| Peter Aitken |
I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in the
belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
--
Peter Aitken
Remove the crap from my email address before using.
|
|
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| Nancy Young |
Peter Aitken wrote:
>
> I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in the
> belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
> http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
>
> Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
Is it the tipping over thing?
nancy
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| Steve Calvin |
Nancy Young wrote:
> Peter Aitken wrote:
>
>>I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in the
>>belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
>>http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
>>
>>Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
>
>
> Is it the tipping over thing?
>
> nancy
Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking that "now, I'm invincible and
can drive how ever I want to". Not! I've driven 4x4's of all kinds
since I was a teenager. They are very safe if driven responsibly. Same
as a motorcycle. People seem to think that they can go like hell
independent of how twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
Those types typically learn the hard way.
|
|
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| Nancy Young |
Steve Calvin wrote:
>
> Nancy Young wrote:
> > Is it the tipping over thing?
> Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking that "now, I'm invincible and
> can drive how ever I want to". Not! I've driven 4x4's of all kinds
> since I was a teenager. They are very safe if driven responsibly. Same
> as a motorcycle. People seem to think that they can go like hell
> independent of how twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
> Those types typically learn the hard way.
It gets scary when it snows here, people are anxious to show how
great their SUV does in the ice. I just get out of their way.
Consumer Reports did a whole thing about the tipping over issue
quite some time back, as a matter of fact they were sued by some
SUV maker for rating theirs unacceptable they were so prone to
tipping over.
So you don't want to drive behind them, you can't see what's up
ahead, you for sure don't want them behind you, and you don't
especially want them aside you. Like, please don't swerve and tip
over on me?
I swear this is true, I just picked up the paper, a local county
engineer was killed when his Navigator hit the median and flipped
over and over, just yesterday. You see it on the news all the time.
They're just taller than they are wide.
nancy
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|
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| Peter Aitken |
"Nancy Young" <qwerty@monmouth.com> wrote in message
news:41222278.F8E86219@monmouth.com...
> Steve Calvin wrote:
> >
> > Nancy Young wrote:
>
> > > Is it the tipping over thing?
>
> > Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking that "now, I'm invincible and
> > can drive how ever I want to". Not! I've driven 4x4's of all kinds
> > since I was a teenager. They are very safe if driven responsibly. Same
> > as a motorcycle. People seem to think that they can go like hell
> > independent of how twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
> > Those types typically learn the hard way.
>
> It gets scary when it snows here, people are anxious to show how
> great their SUV does in the ice. I just get out of their way.
> Consumer Reports did a whole thing about the tipping over issue
> quite some time back, as a matter of fact they were sued by some
> SUV maker for rating theirs unacceptable they were so prone to
> tipping over.
>
> So you don't want to drive behind them, you can't see what's up
> ahead, you for sure don't want them behind you, and you don't
> especially want them aside you. Like, please don't swerve and tip
> over on me?
>
> I swear this is true, I just picked up the paper, a local county
> engineer was killed when his Navigator hit the median and flipped
> over and over, just yesterday. You see it on the news all the time.
> They're just taller than they are wide.
>
> nancy
It's more than just tipping over. While SUVs are generally safer if you get
into an accident, they are much more likely to *be* in an accident.
Apparently their inferior braking and handling make it impossible to avoid
some accidents that a car could avoid.
--
Peter Aitken
Remove the crap from my email address before using.
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| The Ranger |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 10:36:54 -0400, Steve Calvin <calvin@vnet.ibm.com>
wrote:
==> SUV's an evil danger to Life-and-Limb <==
[snip]
> Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking
> that "now, I'm invincible and can drive how
> ever I want to". [..] People seem to think that
> they can go like hell independent of how
> twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
> Those types typically learn the hard way.
These same "types" [aka: knotheads, jerks, blithering idiots] are the
very target that purchase rice-patty rockets and souped-up two-seaters
with 3-letter monikers because they go fast and drive cool (oh yeah --
and they hug the road like a magnet on steel; their ads show it!)
I own and drive a SUV, a 4WD, and a station wagon. Your summations are
limitedly accurate; it is a mind-set that keeps a driver (and their
passengers) safe.
The Ranger
ObFood: Pan-fried bluegill with cornbread batter and Dutch-oven soda
bread.
|
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| Steve Calvin |
The Ranger wrote:
<snip>
> These same "types" [aka: knotheads, jerks, blithering idiots] are the
> very target that purchase rice-patty rockets and souped-up two-seaters
> with 3-letter monikers because they go fast and drive cool (oh yeah --
> and they hug the road like a magnet on steel; their ads show it!)
>
> I own and drive a SUV, a 4WD, and a station wagon. Your summations are
> limitedly accurate; it is a mind-set that keeps a driver (and their
> passengers) safe.
>
> The Ranger
>
> ObFood: Pan-fried bluegill with cornbread batter and Dutch-oven soda
> bread.
Totally agree. I do sometimes like to drive fast in my Vette but I do
that on a closed track and have had training. What a rush though. The
roads aren't meant for that kind of driving as tempting as it sometimes is.
--
Steve
Why don't they make mouse flavored cat food?
|
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| byakee |
Our pal "Peter Aitken" <paitken@CRAPnc.rr.com> wrote:
<snip>
> It's more than just tipping over. While SUVs are generally safer if you get
> into an accident, they are much more likely to *be* in an accident.
> Apparently their inferior braking and handling make it impossible to avoid
> some accidents that a car could avoid.
I dunno, I still feel safer in my Ford Escape than I ever did in my
Chevy Cavalier (aka "Cadaverlier").
Hey, this could spill over into the casket thread... ;-)
--
J.J. in WA ~ mom, vid gamer, novice cook ~
"I rule you!" - Travis of the Cosmos, ATHF
(COLD to HOT for e-mail)
|
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| Nancy Young |
Peter Aitken wrote:
>
> "Nancy Young" <qwerty@monmouth.com> wrote in message
> > I swear this is true, I just picked up the paper, a local county
> > engineer was killed when his Navigator hit the median and flipped
> > over and over, just yesterday. You see it on the news all the time.
> > They're just taller than they are wide.
> It's more than just tipping over. While SUVs are generally safer if you get
> into an accident, they are much more likely to *be* in an accident.
> Apparently their inferior braking and handling make it impossible to avoid
> some accidents that a car could avoid.
That makes sense. (sorry, I got an error trying to check out the
link) I remember a few years back, a friend of mind bitched about
SUVs being hit with higher insurance rates being put into place for
those vehicles. Hey, underwriting.
At any rate, the braking thing is probably, they don't leave enough
room for a large vehicle to stop. Then they have to swerve to avoid
rear ending someone, then they flip over. It's so common, it has to
be something like that. Every time we have a snowstorm, there is a
picture of an SUV turned over on the front page of the paper.
No, I'm not saying you or your family do that.
nancy
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| PENMART01 |
> The Ranger writes:
>>Steve Calvin wrote:
>==> SUV's an evil danger to Life-and-Limb <==
>[snip]
>> Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking
>> that "now, I'm invincible and can drive how
>> ever I want to". [..] People seem to think that
>> they can go like hell independent of how
>> twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
>> Those types typically learn the hard way.
>
>These same "types" [aka: knotheads, jerks, blithering idiots] are the
>very target that purchase rice-patty rockets and souped-up two-seaters
>with 3-letter monikers because they go fast and drive cool (oh yeah --
>and they hug the road like a magnet on steel; their ads show it!)
>
>I own and drive a SUV, a 4WD, and a station wagon. Your summations are
>limitedly accurate; it is a mind-set that keeps a driver (and their
>passengers) safe.
There are irresponsible idiots driving all types of vehicles, even buses, 18
wheeler semis, and C-ment trucks.
If I gotta be involved in an accident I'd much rather be driving my SUV... it's
near an impossibility to flip my '91 Landcruiser... and one rainy night some
asshole imbecile in a little Suburu ran a red light and plowed into me
broadside, his was totaled, his daugther crippled for life, and as for my
Toyota Rhinosaurus, my insurance paid $1,200 for a new tire, to repair a few
scratches in the armor plate, and a bit of paint. I actually watched in
disbelief as the ignoranus plowed into my rear wheel well, I didn't feel a
thing... all I remember was the low thud of creamed Suburu. This was about 12
years ago. I've been driving my Landcruiser more than 15 years now and it will
very likely go another 15 years (nothing ever wears out 'cept tires and
battery). Sometimes I get bored with it, but if for some reason I ever I need
another vehicle it will be another Landcruiser. I really don't consider any of
the others real SUVs... they're all nothing but a fercocktah pickup truck with
a fancy schmancy cap.... even a Rav4 is really a tall Corrola... it's no wonder
they roll over.
---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
*********
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."
Sheldon
````````````
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| Mrs. Fat ManŽ |
"PENMART01" <penmart01@aol.como> wrote in message
news:20040817135952.28878.00001199@mb-m26.aol.com...
> > The Ranger writes:
>
> >>Steve Calvin wrote:
> >==> SUV's an evil danger to Life-and-Limb <==
> If I gotta be involved in an accident I'd much rather be driving my SUV...
it's
> near an impossibility to flip my '91 Landcruiser... and one rainy night
some
> asshole imbecile in a little Suburu ran a red light and plowed into me
> broadside, his was totaled, his daugther crippled for life, and as for my
> Toyota Rhinosaurus, my insurance paid $1,200 for a new tire, to repair a
few
> scratches in the armor plate, and a bit of paint. I actually watched in
> disbelief as the ignoranus plowed into my rear wheel well, I didn't feel a
> thing... all I remember was the low thud of creamed Suburu. This was
about 12
> years ago. I've been driving my Landcruiser more than 15 years now and it
will
> very likely go another 15 years (nothing ever wears out 'cept tires and
> battery). Sometimes I get bored with it, but if for some reason I ever I
need
> another vehicle it will be another Landcruiser. I really don't consider
any of
> the others real SUVs... they're all nothing but a fercocktah pickup truck
with
> a fancy schmancy cap.... even a Rav4 is really a tall Corrola... it's no
wonder
> they roll over.
>
>
Sheldon, I've got to agree with you, but the old Land Cruisers are the elite
of the SUV's in my opinion.
kili
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| Petey the Wonder Dog |
Far as I can tell, someone wrote:
>Every time we have a snowstorm, there is a
>picture of an SUV turned over on the front page of the paper.
The great thing about FWD is that it can get you out of a snow mound.
The bad thing is that once you get going, FWD is useless and many
drivers think that FWD gives tham more traction.
As was said above somewhere, they're taller than they are wide, and that
ain't good.
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| PENMART01 |
> Petey Dog says:
>
>The bad thing is that many
>drivers think that FWD gives tham more traction.
4WD does give more traction, but not on ice. On ice a 4WD vehicle will go into
a skid just as easily as one without 4WD. But a vehicle 4WD can recover more
easily from a skid on ice, especially those vehicles with Full Time 4WD.
---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
*********
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."
Sheldon
````````````
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| Steve Calvin |
PENMART01 wrote:
>>Petey Dog says:
>>
>>The bad thing is that many
>>drivers think that FWD gives tham more traction.
>
>
> 4WD does give more traction, but not on ice. On ice a 4WD vehicle will go into
> a skid just as easily as one without 4WD. But a vehicle 4WD can recover more
> easily from a skid on ice, especially those vehicles with Full Time 4WD.
>
>
> ---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =---
> ---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
> *********
> "Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."
> Sheldon
> ````````````
As I told my better half when we got together. 4x4 will usually always
"go", stopping is the issue (and turns of course). 4x4 doesn't to any
thing to help stopping a skid's a skid.
--
Steve
Whose cruel idea was it for the word "lisp" to have an "s" in it?
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| Curly Sue |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 11:21:28 -0400, Nancy Young <qwerty@monmouth.com>
wrote:
<snip>
>I swear this is true, I just picked up the paper, a local county
>engineer was killed when his Navigator hit the median and flipped
>over and over, just yesterday. You see it on the news all the time.
>They're just taller than they are wide.
>
>nancy
It's also probably the perception ("invincible") thing. I drove
various VW buses for 15-20 yrs. They were taller than they were wide
and a real thrill on windy days or when passed by a big truck! But
there's the difference- when driving the bus, one had an acute
awareness of the tall and narrow issue, as well as their being
relatively lightweight. So you drove accordingly. Having an
eggbeater for a motor didn't hurt either. How often did one see a VW
bus zoom up behind another car and flash their lights? ;> I only got
a speeding ticket once in my life and that was driving the bus. It
was my father's car; he was so proud! (actually it was for doing 30
mph in a 25 mph zone, nothing macho).
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
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| jmcquown |
Curly Sue wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 11:21:28 -0400, Nancy Young <qwerty@monmouth.com>
> wrote:
> <snip>
>> I swear this is true, I just picked up the paper, a local county
>> engineer was killed when his Navigator hit the median and flipped
>> over and over, just yesterday. You see it on the news all the time.
>> They're just taller than they are wide.
>>
>> nancy
>
> It's also probably the perception ("invincible") thing.
(snippage)
> Sue(tm)
> Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
I do agree it's the perception thing. What's really scary is the
(stereo)typical "soccer mom" drives them with a bunch of children, and seems
to think it entitles her to cut in front of people or drive exceedingly fast
just because it's an SUV. Got news for ya "mom", they don't come with
deflector shields.
Jill
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| Steve Calvin |
jmcquown wrote:
> Curly Sue wrote:
>
>>On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 11:21:28 -0400, Nancy Young <qwerty@monmouth.com>
>>wrote:
>><snip>
>>
>>>I swear this is true, I just picked up the paper, a local county
>>>engineer was killed when his Navigator hit the median and flipped
>>>over and over, just yesterday. You see it on the news all the time.
>>>They're just taller than they are wide.
>>>
>>>nancy
>>
>>It's also probably the perception ("invincible") thing.
>
> (snippage)
>
>
>>Sue(tm)
>>Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
>
>
> I do agree it's the perception thing. What's really scary is the
> (stereo)typical "soccer mom" drives them with a bunch of children, and seems
> to think it entitles her to cut in front of people or drive exceedingly fast
> just because it's an SUV. Got news for ya "mom", they don't come with
> deflector shields.
>
> Jill
>
>
Don't forget the cell phone stuck to one ear.
--
Steve
Whose cruel idea was it for the word "lisp" to have an "s" in it?
|
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| The Ranger |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 17:25:36 GMT, byakee@COLDmail.com (byakee) wrote:
[snip]
>I dunno, I still feel safer in my Ford Escape than
> I ever did in my Chevy Cavalier (aka "Cadaverlier").
[snip]
That's cuz you're higher up and able to see a few car-lengths ahead.
You're also "big-enough" that most drivers "see" you... In a
Cadaverlier, you're dinky, easily ignored or missed; add that can't
see more than the car ahead of you and that's the way of many
compacts.
The "BTDT" Ranger
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| The Ranger |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 13:12:01 -0400, Steve Calvin <calvin@vnet.ibm.com>
wrote:
> The Ranger wrote:
> <snip>
> > These same "types" [aka: knotheads, jerks, blithering
> > idiots] are the very target that purchase rice-patty
> > rockets and souped-up two-seaters with 3-letter
> > monikers because they go fast and drive cool (oh
> > yeah -- and they hug the road like a magnet on steel;
> > their ads show it!)
> >
> > I own and drive a SUV, a 4WD, and a station wagon.
> > Your summations are limitedly accurate; it is a mind-set
> > that keeps a driver (and their passengers) safe.
> >
> > ObFood: Pan-fried bluegill with cornbread batter and
> > Dutch-oven soda bread.
> >
> Totally agree. I do sometimes like to drive fast in my Vette
> but I do that on a closed track and have had training. What
> a rush though. The roads aren't meant for that kind of
> driving as tempting as it sometimes is.
>
You find the same -- if not in greater numbers -- untrained idiots
attempting some of the most brain-dead, testosterone-driven stunts in
the wild for a similar rush. They live by the motto, "Hey y'all! Watch
this!" Unfortunately, they aren't the ones that suffer (except in
their wallet). The gahdz love idiots and fools and keep them safest.
ObExampletoOthers: Funniest situation I ever witnessed was a
20-somethinger that took his factory-new, less-than-ten-days-old,
five-year-finance packaged Nissan (aka Datsun) off-road on a dare. He
found a "jump" that only "looked" like a hop across an arroyo to a
smaller cliff. Somewhere during his drive down the hill to the jump,
he'd realized he didn't quite work through the finer details and tried
to slam on his breaks (imagine soft, gravelly dirt rutted throughout
by rain-wash). His SUV had enough momentum to carry it up the ramp
and across the mini-arroyo. His bumper flopped across to the opposite
edge and kinked his frame at a funky angle. Bruises and contusions
aside, all he managed to mumble between his hands was, "My dad's gonna
kill me." [Ad nauseum.]
The Ranger
--
"Well, son, I see your General Lee's been retired."
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| Curly Sue |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 16:49:31 -0400, Steve Calvin
<calvins@optonline.net> wrote:
>jmcquown wrote:
>> I do agree it's the perception thing. What's really scary is the
>> (stereo)typical "soccer mom" drives them with a bunch of children, and seems
>> to think it entitles her to cut in front of people or drive exceedingly fast
>> just because it's an SUV. Got news for ya "mom", they don't come with
>> deflector shields.
>>
>> Jill
>>
>>
>Don't forget the cell phone stuck to one ear.
>
>--
>Steve
99.9% of the time the people around here with cell phones stuck to
their ear are fairly good-looking post-adolescent males. No one else
in the car, and they generally are turning the corner while talking.
But it's not like I notice ;>
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
|
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| Dan Abel |
In article <41222278.F8E86219@monmouth.com>, qwerty@monmouth.com wrote:
> Consumer Reports did a whole thing about the tipping over issue
> quite some time back, as a matter of fact they were sued by some
> SUV maker for rating theirs unacceptable they were so prone to
> tipping over.
It was a Suzuki Samurai, and they just got sued again for mentioning it
again. I remember when the review first came out. They showed a picture
of the vehicle with the "training wheels" they had installed on it to keep
it from tipping during testing.
--
Dan Abel
Sonoma State University
AIS
dabel@sonic.net
|
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| Fx199 |
>Consumer Reports did a whole thing about the tipping over issue
>quite some time back, as a matter of fact they were sued by some
>SUV maker for rating theirs unacceptable they were so prone to
>tipping over.
>
Jesus Christ, it's not a car, don't drive it like one. The SUV only does what
the operator tells it. SUV's are just a scapegoat.
|
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| Dog3 |
"Peter Aitken" <paitken@CRAPnc.rr.com>
news:QInUc.174932$wH4.11303923@twister.southeast.rr.com:
> I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in
> the belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
> http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
>
> Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
>
I am sure many of the safety issues with SUVs lie with the driver. It's
amazing to see how some people think they are invincible when they climb
the running board and into the seat of some giant monstrosity they can
neither drive correctly, or park. Add a cell phone to the factors and you
can smell the danger all the way down the block.
If drivers used common sense when they got behind the wheel, the streets
would be much safer.
Michael <- drives Jeeps and has only toatled one in 20 years
--
Never drink black coffee at lunch; it will keep you awake all afternoon.
Jilly Cooper
|
|
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| Fx199 |
>Sheldon, I've got to agree with you, but the old Land Cruisers are the elite
>of the SUV's in my opinion.
>
>kili
>
What's wrong with the new ones?
|
|
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| Dog3 |
penmart01@aol.como (PENMART01)
news:20040817135952.28878.00001199@mb-m26.aol.com:
>> The Ranger writes:
>
>>>Steve Calvin wrote:
>>==> SUV's an evil danger to Life-and-Limb <==
>>[snip]
>>> Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking
>>> that "now, I'm invincible and can drive how
>>> ever I want to". [..] People seem to think that
>>> they can go like hell independent of how
>>> twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
>>> Those types typically learn the hard way.
>>
>>These same "types" [aka: knotheads, jerks, blithering idiots] are the
>>very target that purchase rice-patty rockets and souped-up two-seaters
>>with 3-letter monikers because they go fast and drive cool (oh yeah --
>>and they hug the road like a magnet on steel; their ads show it!)
>>
>>I own and drive a SUV, a 4WD, and a station wagon. Your summations are
>>limitedly accurate; it is a mind-set that keeps a driver (and their
>>passengers) safe.
>
> There are irresponsible idiots driving all types of vehicles, even
> buses, 18 wheeler semis, and C-ment trucks.
>
> If I gotta be involved in an accident I'd much rather be driving my
> SUV... it's near an impossibility to flip my '91 Landcruiser... and
> one rainy night some asshole imbecile in a little Suburu ran a red
> light and plowed into me broadside, his was totaled, his daugther
> crippled for life, and as for my Toyota Rhinosaurus, my insurance paid
> $1,200 for a new tire, to repair a few scratches in the armor plate,
> and a bit of paint. I actually watched in disbelief as the ignoranus
> plowed into my rear wheel well, I didn't feel a thing... all I
> remember was the low thud of creamed Suburu. This was about 12 years
> ago. I've been driving my Landcruiser more than 15 years now and it
> will very likely go another 15 years (nothing ever wears out 'cept
> tires and battery). Sometimes I get bored with it, but if for some
> reason I ever I need another vehicle it will be another Landcruiser.
> I really don't consider any of the others real SUVs... they're all
> nothing but a fercocktah pickup truck with a fancy schmancy cap....
> even a Rav4 is really a tall Corrola... it's no wonder they roll over.
I'd rather be in my Jeep than a car in an accident. I walked away from a
nasty accident completely unscathed. The Jeep is not nearly as sturdy as a
Landcruiser but it'll do in low speed accidents.
OTOH, when I lived in the city I witnessed an accident at West Pine and
Kingshighway (a notorious accident intersection). A Volvo ran a red light
and plowed broadside into one of those Ford Explorers. The impact was so
great the Ford not only tipped on it's side but rolled over on it's top.
The Volvo lady seemed unhurt. The ambulance took away the Ford's
occupants.
Michael
--
Never drink black coffee at lunch; it will keep you awake all afternoon.
Jilly Cooper
|
|
|
| Grismalkin |
> Peter Aitken wrote:
>>
>>>I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in the
>>>belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
>>>http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
>>>
>>>Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
>>
>>
>> Is it the tipping over thing?
>>
>> nancy
>
>Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking that "now, I'm invincible and
>can drive how ever I want to". Not! I've driven 4x4's of all kinds
>since I was a teenager. They are very safe if driven responsibly. Same
>as a motorcycle. People seem to think that they can go like hell
>independent of how twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
>Those types typically learn the hard way.
>
Like the guy who passed us on the road to the Grand Canyon a few years ago in
his Range Rover. It was snowing like hell and at night, so my husband was
driving very carefully. When he was ahead of us we saw the vehicle spin out
and end up upside down. Luckily, noone was hurt, and we drove some of his
passengers to their lodge, as did another driver. They had their rooms already
booked and we didn't, so what was the guy's big hurry? His teenage niece was
very shaken.
|
|
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| Petey the Wonder Dog |
Far as I can tell, someone wrote:
>I drove
>various VW buses for 15-20 yrs. They were taller than they were wide
>and a real thrill on windy days or when passed by a big truck! But
>there's the difference- when driving the bus, one had an acute
>awareness of the tall and narrow issue, as well as their being
>relatively lightweight.
The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
|
|
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| Nancy Young |
Fx199 wrote:
>
> >Consumer Reports did a whole thing about the tipping over issue
> >quite some time back, as a matter of fact they were sued by some
> >SUV maker for rating theirs unacceptable they were so prone to
> >tipping over.
> >
>
> Jesus Christ, it's not a car, don't drive it like one. The SUV only does what
> the operator tells it. SUV's are just a scapegoat.
Don't yell at me. Tell the SUV drivers.
nancy
|
|
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| Fx199 |
>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>
Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
|
|
|
| Fx199 |
>Don't yell at me. Tell the SUV drivers.
>
>nancy
No problem, quit blaming the SUV's as a vehicle when it's the driver
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| Curly Sue |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 22:14:19 -0000, Dog3 <dognospam@adjfkdla;not>
wrote:
>OTOH, when I lived in the city I witnessed an accident at West Pine and
>Kingshighway (a notorious accident intersection). A Volvo ran a red light
>and plowed broadside into one of those Ford Explorers. The impact was so
>great the Ford not only tipped on it's side but rolled over on it's top.
>The Volvo lady seemed unhurt. The ambulance took away the Ford's
>occupants.
Force = mass x acceleration
It's amazing what a little speed can do!
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
|
|
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| Nancy Young |
Fx199 wrote:
>
> >Don't yell at me. Tell the SUV drivers.
> >
> >nancy
>
> No problem, quit blaming the SUV's as a vehicle when it's the driver
Well, my car is tested for driver error, why not SUVs?
nancy
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|
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| Fx199 |
>Well, my car is tested for driver error, why not SUVs?
>
>nancy
>
well, if you accept the "dumbing down" of things I guess there's no reaching
you
|
|
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| Steve Calvin |
Fx199 wrote:
>>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>>
>
>
> Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
With the extremely low center of gravity that those suckers had I'd
probably *guess* that yes, they'd be harder to tip than todays SUV's.
--
Steve
Whose cruel idea was it for the word "lisp" to have an "s" in it?
|
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| Curly Sue |
On 17 Aug 2004 23:56:24 GMT, fx199@aol.com (Fx199) wrote:
>>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>>
>
>Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
Well, I have to say that for all the years I drove buses I never heard
or read any source express concern that they would tip or roll over,
very different from all the publicity the SUV issue gets. Even when I
(occasionally) went around corners on two wheels, my major concern was
for the tires, not the car tipping over. They simply didn't have the
power that SUVs have, steering was manual as was shifting,, so one
couldn't usually move and maneuver fast enough to become unstable.
I did hear, however, that the microbuses were sometimes banned from
bridges in high wind situations. But that wasn't for tipping, more
for the tendency to get pulled into another lane when the wind was
perpendicular.
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
|
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| Dog3 |
address.in.sig@nyc.rr.com (Curly Sue)
news:41229a2d.18198286@news-server.nyc.rr.com:
>
> It's amazing what a little speed can do!
>
> Sue(tm)
> Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
Ohhhh... speed. Finals week my senior year in college. I was awake for
days ;)
Michael <- being a smart ass
--
Never drink black coffee at lunch; it will keep you awake all afternoon.
Jilly Cooper
|
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| Fx199 |
>Here it's more likely to be the Mooomie (and her 8.6 kids) who is
>simultaneously screaming at the kids in the back seat, breastfeeding
>and talking on her cell phone. Yeah, she *really* needs 4WD...
>
>-L.
>
>
>
>
>
>
About as much as you need another piece of bacon or a doughnut, I'm sure.
|
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| SportKite1 |
>From: address.in.sig@nyc.rr.com
>99.9% of the time the people around here with cell phones stuck to
>their ear are fairly good-looking post-adolescent males. No one else
>in the car, and they generally are turning the corner while talking.
Not around here. 75% women 18-49 - the rest salesmen or construction workers.
Seems like cell phones don't change one thing I've noted over the years - women
like to yap on the phone more than men. Hehehehee!
Ellen
|
|
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| Steve Calvin |
SportKite1 wrote:
>>From: address.in.sig@nyc.rr.com
>
>
>>99.9% of the time the people around here with cell phones stuck to
>>their ear are fairly good-looking post-adolescent males. No one else
>>in the car, and they generally are turning the corner while talking.
>
>
> Not around here. 75% women 18-49 - the rest salesmen or construction workers.
> Seems like cell phones don't change one thing I've noted over the years - women
> like to yap on the phone more than men. Hehehehee!
>
> Ellen
>
>
Ditto here. The thing that gets me is that I've seen both State
Troopers and locals immediately behind some yahoo with a phone glued to
their ear and never stop 'em.
--
Steve
Why don't they make mouse flavored cat food?
|
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| Bob Myers |
"Nancy Young" <qwerty@monmouth.com> wrote in message
news:41229E88.D3C5D598@monmouth.com...
> > No problem, quit blaming the SUV's as a vehicle when it's the driver
>
> Well, my car is tested for driver error, why not SUVs?
I'm having a hard time understanding just what
"my car is tested for driver error" means...could you help
me out a bit, please?
Bob M.
|
|
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| Nancy Young |
Bob Myers wrote:
>
> "Nancy Young" <qwerty@monmouth.com> wrote in message
> news:41229E88.D3C5D598@monmouth.com...
>
> > > No problem, quit blaming the SUV's as a vehicle when it's the driver
> >
> > Well, my car is tested for driver error, why not SUVs?
>
> I'm having a hard time understanding just what
> "my car is tested for driver error" means...could you help
> me out a bit, please?
By the car companies when they make them. They put them through
tests, as does the whatever safety commission. They test them to
see how long it takes them to stop, etc etc etc. How they react
in a crash.
nancy
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| Petey the Wonder Dog |
Far as I can tell, someone wrote:
>>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
Yup.
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| Uncle Meat@earthlink.net |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 10:36:54 -0400 in <2oeji6F9m3r0U1@uni-berlin.de>,
Steve Calvin <calvin@vnet.ibm.com> graced the world with this thought:
>
>
>Nancy Young wrote:
>
>> Peter Aitken wrote:
>>
>>>I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in the
>>>belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
>>>http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
>>>
>>>Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
>>
>>
>> Is it the tipping over thing?
>>
>> nancy
>
>Yup.
Years old news at this point.
In any case, it's not a Ferrari. Drive it lilke an SUV instead of a F1
racer, and it won't tip over.
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| Uncle Meat@earthlink.net |
On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 10:07:28 -0700 in
<b8a4i0105vbv8e46okl1j4mfaktmcomh73@4ax.com>, The Ranger
<cuhulain_-98@yahoo.com> graced the world with this thought:
>On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 10:36:54 -0400, Steve Calvin <calvin@vnet.ibm.com>
>wrote:
>==> SUV's an evil danger to Life-and-Limb <==
>[snip]
>> Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking
>> that "now, I'm invincible and can drive how
>> ever I want to". [..] People seem to think that
>> they can go like hell independent of how
>> twisty the roads are, whether they're icy, etc...
>> Those types typically learn the hard way.
>
>These same "types" [aka: knotheads, jerks, blithering idiots] are the
>very target that purchase rice-patty rockets and souped-up two-seaters
>with 3-letter monikers because they go fast and drive cool (oh yeah --
>and they hug the road like a magnet on steel; their ads show it!)
>
>I own and drive a SUV, a 4WD, and a station wagon. Your summations are
>limitedly accurate; it is a mind-set that keeps a driver (and their
>passengers) safe.
Exactly. Hey, you know, if you drive around with a trunk full of
nitro, the vehicle is dangerous, too!
I drive a CJ5 sometimes, lifted beyond belief, with 35" tires on it
and an 82 inch wheelbase. This vehicle was deemed unsafe when it was
stock, and AMC stopped the line after it had been made for about 35
years. I literally have to climb into it, and some people need a foot
stool to get in. The first thing I noticed when I got it was that,
yes, this is not a go-kart, and is incapable of taking mountain roads
in excess of 70mph. I'd be happy, however, to race anyone in one of
those guided missles you mention to the tip of Baja for pink slips.
I don't expect a cat to bark, a fish to fly, or a cow to give wine.
|
|
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| Nancy Young |
Uncle, Meat@earthlink.net wrote:
> Steve Calvin <calvin@vnet.ibm.com> graced the world with this thought:
> >> Is it the tipping over thing?
> >>
> >> nancy
> >
> >Yup.
>
> Years old news at this point.
> In any case, it's not a Ferrari. Drive it lilke an SUV instead of a F1
> racer, and it won't tip over.
I'll be sure to alert the SUV drivers that populate my state. I'm
sure they'll listen as soon as they hang up the cell phone.
nancy
|
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| PENMART01 |
>Petey the Dog
>
>>Far as I can tell, someone wrote:
>>
>>>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>>>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>
>>Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
>
>Yup.
Um, I don't think it's an honest comparison when the VW bus contains a water
bed.
---= BOYCOTT FRANCE (belgium) GERMANY--SPAIN =---
---= Move UNITED NATIONS To Paris =---
*********
"Life would be devoid of all meaning were it without tribulation."
Sheldon
````````````
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| Steve Calvin |
Uncle wrote:
> On Tue, 17 Aug 2004 10:36:54 -0400 in <2oeji6F9m3r0U1@uni-berlin.de>,
> Steve Calvin <calvin@vnet.ibm.com> graced the world with this thought:
>
>
>>
>>Nancy Young wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Peter Aitken wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I thought this might be of interest to some. Many people buy an SUV in the
>>>>belief that it is safer. The truth is the exact opposite - see
>>>>http://money.cnn.com/2004/08/17/pf/...dex.htm?cnn=yes
>>>>
>>>>Sort of chilling - one of our 2 cars is an SUV.
>>>
>>>
>>>Is it the tipping over thing?
>>>
>>>nancy
>>
>>Yup.
>
>
> Years old news at this point.
> In any case, it's not a Ferrari. Drive it lilke an SUV instead of a F1
> racer, and it won't tip over.
If you're going to attribute to me, please get it right. I don't mind
being quoted but I DO mind being quoted out of context.
Had you accurately quoted my original post you may have noticed that
my point was focused on the same point as yours.
Original post attachment:
Yup. Way too many people buy 'em thinking that "now, I'm invincible
and can drive how ever I want to". Not! I've driven 4x4's of all
kinds since I was a teenager. They are very safe if driven
responsibly. Same as a motorcycle. People seem to think that they can
go like hell independent of how twisty the roads are, whether they're
icy, etc...
Those types typically learn the hard way.
--
Steve
Whose cruel idea was it for the word "lisp" to have an "s" in it?
|
|
|
| -L. : |
fx199@aol.com (Fx199) wrote in message news:<20040818073024.25422.00003554@mb-m29.aol.com>...
> >Here it's more likely to be the Mooomie (and her 8.6 kids) who is
> >simultaneously screaming at the kids in the back seat, breastfeeding
> >and talking on her cell phone. Yeah, she *really* needs 4WD...
> >
> >-L.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> About as much as you need another piece of bacon or a doughnut, I'm sure.
Don't eat either, actually...
-L.
|
|
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| Fx199 |
>
>>Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
>
>Yup.
>
We know what your opinion's worth now.
|
|
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| Hairy |
"Steve Calvin" <calvins@optonline.net> wrote in message
news:2ofmjpFa4afaU1@uni-berlin.de...
> Fx199 wrote:
> >>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
> >>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
>
> With the extremely low center of gravity that those suckers had I'd
> probably *guess* that yes, they'd be harder to tip than todays SUV's.
>
> --
> Steve
Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses? That old
swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any SUV
made today.
Dave
|
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| Curly Sue |
On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 09:53:10 -0500, "Hairy" <hairy411@hotmail.com>
wrote:
>
>"Steve Calvin" <calvins@optonline.net> wrote in message
>news:2ofmjpFa4afaU1@uni-berlin.de...
>> Fx199 wrote:
>> >>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>> >>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>> > Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
>>
>> With the extremely low center of gravity that those suckers had I'd
>> probably *guess* that yes, they'd be harder to tip than todays SUV's.
>>
>> --
>> Steve
>
>Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses? That old
>swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any SUV
>made today.
>
>Dave
But they didn't and SUVs do. Apparently other factors were more
important.
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
|
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| Michael Odom |
On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 15:18:34 GMT, address.in.sig@nyc.rr.com (Curly
Sue) wrote:
>On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 09:53:10 -0500, "Hairy" <hairy411@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>"Steve Calvin" <calvins@optonline.net> wrote in message
>>news:2ofmjpFa4afaU1@uni-berlin.de...
>>> Fx199 wrote:
>>> >>The other thing about VW buses, similar to those English double decker
>>> >>buses, is that they were bottom heavy. Hard to tip over.
>
>>> > Harder to tip over than a modern SUV you contend??
>>>
>>> With the extremely low center of gravity that those suckers had I'd
>>> probably *guess* that yes, they'd be harder to tip than todays SUV's.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Steve
>>
>>Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses? That old
>>swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any SUV
>>made today.
>>
>>Dave
>
>But they didn't and SUVs do. Apparently other factors were more
>important.
>
Yup. One significant technological bit involves the nut behind the
wheel.
OBFood: Burgers for dinner tonight if it'll ever stop raining so I can
grill them in relative comfort.
modom
"Dallas is a rich man with a death wish in his eyes."
-- Jimmie Dale Gilmore
|
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| Terry Pulliam Burd |
On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 12:50:41 -0500, Michael Odom <modom@un-koyote.com>
arranged random neurons, so they looked like this:
>Yup. One significant technological bit involves the nut behind the
>wheel.
This may already have been addressed (I'm late to the thread or missed
a chunk or something) is that SUV drivers seem to think they're bullet
proof. When I lived in Colorado, you were much more likely to find an
SUV (also known as an UAV - Urban Assault Vehicle) plowed into a
snowbank on the side of the road than a sedan. Having four wheel drive
doesn't mean you can actually steer on ice or vehicle-compacted snow,
for instance. No matter what you're driving: if you're on ice or
compacted snow, you're not driving a car, you're aiming it.
Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA
"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret
had been as old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had
been as full as the waitress', it would have been a very
good dinner." Duncan Hines
To reply, remove replace "spaminator" with "cox"
|
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| Hairy |
> >Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses? That
old
> >swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any SUV
> >made today.
> >
> >Dave
>
> But they didn't and SUVs do. Apparently other factors were more
> important.
>
> Sue(tm)
Sure they did, you just didn't hear about them. Back in the day, if a bus
rolled over, nobody cared. Today with all the SUV controversy, if a SUV
rolls over, it's big news. Another thing to consider is the fact that Ford
builds nearly as many Explorers in a month as VW made busses in their peak
year. Add to that all the other SUV's on the market and you're comparing
thousands to millions. Of course more SUV's are going to roll over simply
because there are millions more of them on the road.
Dave
|
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| Curly Sue |
On Thu, 19 Aug 2004 21:27:25 -0500, "Hairy" <hairy411@hotmail.com>
wrote:
>
>
>> >Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses? That
>old
>> >swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any SUV
>> >made today.
>> >
>> >Dave
>>
>> But they didn't and SUVs do. Apparently other factors were more
>> important.
>>
>> Sue(tm)
>
>Sure they did, you just didn't hear about them. Back in the day, if a bus
>rolled over, nobody cared.
That's baloney.
> Today with all the SUV controversy, if a SUV
>rolls over, it's big news. Another thing to consider is the fact that Ford
>builds nearly as many Explorers in a month as VW made busses in their peak
>year. Add to that all the other SUV's on the market and you're comparing
>thousands to millions. Of course more SUV's are going to roll over simply
>because there are millions more of them on the road.
>
>Dave
Being on the road doesn't make a car roll over. At least it didn't
with VW buses.
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
|
|
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| Peter Aitken |
"Hairy" <hairy411@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2ol5skFc5imgU1@uni-berlin.de...
>
>
> > >Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses?
That
> old
> > >swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any
SUV
> > >made today.
> > >
> > >Dave
> >
> > But they didn't and SUVs do. Apparently other factors were more
> > important.
> >
> > Sue(tm)
>
> Sure they did, you just didn't hear about them. Back in the day, if a bus
> rolled over, nobody cared. Today with all the SUV controversy, if a SUV
> rolls over, it's big news. Another thing to consider is the fact that Ford
> builds nearly as many Explorers in a month as VW made busses in their peak
> year. Add to that all the other SUV's on the market and you're comparing
> thousands to millions. Of course more SUV's are going to roll over simply
> because there are millions more of them on the road.
>
> Dave
>
>
You made a claim about VW busses rolling over and have not backed it up with
even a shred of evidence. You may be 100% correct but you should understand
that people are unwilling to accept this claim just on your say-so.
--
Peter Aitken
Remove the crap from my email address before using.
|
|
|
| Hairy |
"Peter Aitken" <paitken@CRAPnc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:ASmVc.263399$2o2.15933919@twister.southeast.rr.com...
> "Hairy" <hairy411@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:2ol5skFc5imgU1@uni-berlin.de...
> >
> >
> > > >Ever notice how the wheels tilt in at the bottom on the old busses?
> That
> > old
> > > >swingaxle suspension made them much more likely to tip over than any
> SUV
> > > >made today.
> > > >
> > > >Dave
> > >
> > > But they didn't and SUVs do. Apparently other factors were more
> > > important.
> > >
> > > Sue(tm)
> >
> > Sure they did, you just didn't hear about them. Back in the day, if a
bus
> > rolled over, nobody cared. Today with all the SUV controversy, if a SUV
> > rolls over, it's big news. Another thing to consider is the fact that
Ford
> > builds nearly as many Explorers in a month as VW made busses in their
peak
> > year. Add to that all the other SUV's on the market and you're comparing
> > thousands to millions. Of course more SUV's are going to roll over
simply
> > because there are millions more of them on the road.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
>
> You made a claim about VW busses rolling over and have not backed it up
with
> even a shred of evidence. You may be 100% correct but you should
understand
> that people are unwilling to accept this claim just on your say-so.
>
>
> --
> Peter Aitken
>
You are correct, I have no evidence to provide. All I can provide is my 40
years of experience, owning and restoring vintage Volkswagens. Years of
scrounging junkyards and recyclers for hard to find parts has shown me more
evidence of rolled busses than I ever wanted to see.
Believe what you wish, I have nothing more to add to this subject.
|
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| Curly Sue |
More bad news about SUVs (and 4WD in general):
Apparently they are causing havoc in the Sahara too, fostering dust
storms:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5769840/
Sue(tm)
Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself!
|
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|
