| Re: Skate Wings, pasta and pizza crusts - CLICK HERE for the Cooking Forum Index |
| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11miu4hojpc3lb0@corp.supernews.com>,
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
> aem wrote:
> > Bob (this one) wrote:
> >
> >>aem wrote:
> >>
> >>>So you assert five more times that restaurants don't cook pasta to
> >>>order, and you argue at great length that in your experience it can't
> >>>be done, it takes too long, it taxes kitchen resources too greatly.
> >>>
> >>>That's your experience and what you know.
> >>
> >>Sorry, aem, it's what *the industry* knows. [snip the rest]
> >
> > Nothing new here. Same old denial of the validity of anyone else's
> > experience but your own. Guess we're done. -aem
>
> Um, you've offered no "experience" information except to say that you
> can tell when pasta is reheated and you only patronize those places that
> cook from scratch.
>
> How can you tell? What would be the informing characteristics?
>
> How do you know? Relate your experience. Try to do a bit better than you
> did when listing "names" of places that you're sure cook from scratch.
> Oh, wait. You didn't list any names. Just Boston, California...
>
> Oh, yeah. Experience...
>
> Pastorio
While I do respect aem's opinions, (everybody is entitled to likes and
dislikes, and I probably respect it MORE since I grew up with parents
that made me eat stuff I hated and I still hate most of the same stuff
to this day!), I'm curious as to how he can tell "fresh" from reheated
pasta.
I do that here at home (refrigerate extra pasta coated in Olive oil for
use the next day) and cannot tell any real difference.
I especially will do that for pasta salads as it really needs to be well
chilled prior to adding mayonaisse or it "breaks" it.
Just out of real curiosity, not out of any disagreement.
Pastorio has a point about serving logistics in real life, high volume
situations. I just don't see how preparing each order from scratch could
_possibly_ be practical.
We were very, very close freinds with a married couple from Italy when I
was growing up. Leo and Maria Scarcelli ran a place called "Leo's
Italian Restaurant" in Los Angeles California.
He pre-cooked batches of different types of pastas. There was a hot
basin of olive oil and sausage juice on the back of the grill too with
meatballs and whole italian sausages for quick use for both pasta dishes
and pizzas. Maria's lasagna would be made in batches, separated into
portions and chilled. There were no microwaves at the time so they were
warmed in the pizza oven.
He also pre-made pizza crusts and stored them on a rack in the kitchen.
Leo also smoked cigars while he was making pizza crusts so there would
occasionally be a bit of cigar ash on the flour board. ;-)
This was back in the early 70's.
Cheers!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| Bob (this one) |
OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> In article <11miu4hojpc3lb0@corp.supernews.com>,
> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>
>>aem wrote:
>>
>>>Bob (this one) wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>aem wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>So you assert five more times that restaurants don't cook pasta to
>>>>>order, and you argue at great length that in your experience it can't
>>>>>be done, it takes too long, it taxes kitchen resources too greatly.
>>>>>
>>>>>That's your experience and what you know.
>>>>
>>>>Sorry, aem, it's what *the industry* knows. [snip the rest]
>>>
>>>Nothing new here. Same old denial of the validity of anyone else's
>>>experience but your own. Guess we're done. -aem
>>
>>Um, you've offered no "experience" information except to say that you
>>can tell when pasta is reheated and you only patronize those places that
>>cook from scratch.
>>
>>How can you tell? What would be the informing characteristics?
>>
>>How do you know? Relate your experience. Try to do a bit better than you
>>did when listing "names" of places that you're sure cook from scratch.
>>Oh, wait. You didn't list any names. Just Boston, California...
>>
>>Oh, yeah. Experience...
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> While I do respect aem's opinions, (everybody is entitled to likes and
> dislikes, and I probably respect it MORE since I grew up with parents
> that made me eat stuff I hated and I still hate most of the same stuff
> to this day!), I'm curious as to how he can tell "fresh" from reheated
> pasta.
I can't imagine. I've never met anyone who could tell, in all those
years of doing it.
Our technique (and pretty much everybody else's) was to partially cook
the pasta, drain and immediately toss with olive oil. We poured it into
big, metal hotel pans to cool and then portioned it (12 ounces by
weight) into cheapo plastic bags to hold, then into the fridge. Each
shape of pasta had its own cook time: spaghetti for 6 minutes, ziti for
8 minutes, egg papardelle for 5 minutes, etc. When it came time to
"rethermalize" (heh) the pasta, it went into boiling water for about 1
1/2 minutes. It reached full boiled temperature, and we could even do
any of the egg or custard sauces that depended on full heat from the
pasta to cook the egg (carbonara being the most well-known). Our pasta
dishes were very popular, both at lunch and dinner. Typical days in my
last restaurant ranged from a low of around 100 portions up to maybe 350
- as high as 500 on busy days. More for banquets - could go up to 750
some days, especially around the holidays.
> I do that here at home (refrigerate extra pasta coated in Olive oil for
> use the next day) and cannot tell any real difference.
> I especially will do that for pasta salads as it really needs to be well
> chilled prior to adding mayonaisse or it "breaks" it.
Try it one time with a light coating of vinaigrette while it's still
warm. It'll disappear into the pasta. Then after it's cooled, add just a
little mayo. The flavor sparkles.
Pastorio
> Just out of real curiosity, not out of any disagreement.
>
> Pastorio has a point about serving logistics in real life, high volume
> situations. I just don't see how preparing each order from scratch could
> _possibly_ be practical.
>
> We were very, very close freinds with a married couple from Italy when I
> was growing up. Leo and Maria Scarcelli ran a place called "Leo's
> Italian Restaurant" in Los Angeles California.
>
> He pre-cooked batches of different types of pastas. There was a hot
> basin of olive oil and sausage juice on the back of the grill too with
> meatballs and whole italian sausages for quick use for both pasta dishes
> and pizzas. Maria's lasagna would be made in batches, separated into
> portions and chilled. There were no microwaves at the time so they were
> warmed in the pizza oven.
>
> He also pre-made pizza crusts and stored them on a rack in the kitchen.
>
> Leo also smoked cigars while he was making pizza crusts so there would
> occasionally be a bit of cigar ash on the flour board. ;-)
>
> This was back in the early 70's.
>
> Cheers!
|
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11mj9k3k3inv7e3@corp.supernews.com>,
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
> > I do that here at home (refrigerate extra pasta coated in Olive oil for
> > use the next day) and cannot tell any real difference.
> > I especially will do that for pasta salads as it really needs to be well
> > chilled prior to adding mayonaisse or it "breaks" it.
>
> Try it one time with a light coating of vinaigrette while it's still
> warm. It'll disappear into the pasta. Then after it's cooled, add just a
> little mayo. The flavor sparkles.
>
> Pastorio
That sounds good! Thanks! :-)
Even a little bottled italian dressing might be interesting.
The holidays are coming up and pasta salads makes good potluck. I like
to use the tri-colored twisty pasta and add sliced olives, mayo (lime
based) and fake crab, along with some minced chives and basil if I have
it on hand.
Cheers!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
|
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| ~patches~ |
Bob (this one) wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
>> In article <11miu4hojpc3lb0@corp.supernews.com>,
>> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> aem wrote:
>>>
>>>> Bob (this one) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> aem wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> So you assert five more times that restaurants don't cook pasta to
>>>>>> order, and you argue at great length that in your experience it can't
>>>>>> be done, it takes too long, it taxes kitchen resources too greatly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's your experience and what you know.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, aem, it's what *the industry* knows. [snip the rest]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Nothing new here. Same old denial of the validity of anyone else's
>>>> experience but your own. Guess we're done. -aem
>>>
>>>
>>> Um, you've offered no "experience" information except to say that you
>>> can tell when pasta is reheated and you only patronize those places
>>> that cook from scratch.
>>>
>>> How can you tell? What would be the informing characteristics?
>>>
>>> How do you know? Relate your experience. Try to do a bit better than
>>> you did when listing "names" of places that you're sure cook from
>>> scratch. Oh, wait. You didn't list any names. Just Boston, California...
>>>
>>> Oh, yeah. Experience...
>>>
>>> Pastorio
>>
>>
>> While I do respect aem's opinions, (everybody is entitled to likes and
>> dislikes, and I probably respect it MORE since I grew up with parents
>> that made me eat stuff I hated and I still hate most of the same stuff
>> to this day!), I'm curious as to how he can tell "fresh" from reheated
>> pasta.
>
>
> I can't imagine. I've never met anyone who could tell, in all those
> years of doing it.
I certainly can tell when the over re-heat the pasta & it comes out
thick & mushy for lack of a better word :( I hate that! There's no
point even chewing the pasta then. Major ick!
|
|
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| ~patches~ |
Bob (this one) wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
>> In article <11miu4hojpc3lb0@corp.supernews.com>,
>> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> aem wrote:
>>>
>>>> Bob (this one) wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> aem wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> So you assert five more times that restaurants don't cook pasta to
>>>>>> order, and you argue at great length that in your experience it can't
>>>>>> be done, it takes too long, it taxes kitchen resources too greatly.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> That's your experience and what you know.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, aem, it's what *the industry* knows. [snip the rest]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Nothing new here. Same old denial of the validity of anyone else's
>>>> experience but your own. Guess we're done. -aem
>>>
>>>
>>> Um, you've offered no "experience" information except to say that you
>>> can tell when pasta is reheated and you only patronize those places
>>> that cook from scratch.
>>>
>>> How can you tell? What would be the informing characteristics?
>>>
>>> How do you know? Relate your experience. Try to do a bit better than
>>> you did when listing "names" of places that you're sure cook from
>>> scratch. Oh, wait. You didn't list any names. Just Boston, California...
>>>
>>> Oh, yeah. Experience...
>>>
>>> Pastorio
>>
>>
>> While I do respect aem's opinions, (everybody is entitled to likes and
>> dislikes, and I probably respect it MORE since I grew up with parents
>> that made me eat stuff I hated and I still hate most of the same stuff
>> to this day!), I'm curious as to how he can tell "fresh" from reheated
>> pasta.
>
>
> I can't imagine. I've never met anyone who could tell, in all those
> years of doing it.
I certainly can tell when the over re-heat the pasta & it comes out
thick & mushy for lack of a better word :( I hate that! There's no
point even chewing the pasta then. Major ick!
|
|
|
| Bob (this one) |
OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> In article <11miu4hojpc3lb0@corp.supernews.com>,
> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>
>>aem wrote:
>>
>>>Bob (this one) wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>aem wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>So you assert five more times that restaurants don't cook pasta to
>>>>>order, and you argue at great length that in your experience it can't
>>>>>be done, it takes too long, it taxes kitchen resources too greatly.
>>>>>
>>>>>That's your experience and what you know.
>>>>
>>>>Sorry, aem, it's what *the industry* knows. [snip the rest]
>>>
>>>Nothing new here. Same old denial of the validity of anyone else's
>>>experience but your own. Guess we're done. -aem
>>
>>Um, you've offered no "experience" information except to say that you
>>can tell when pasta is reheated and you only patronize those places that
>>cook from scratch.
>>
>>How can you tell? What would be the informing characteristics?
>>
>>How do you know? Relate your experience. Try to do a bit better than you
>>did when listing "names" of places that you're sure cook from scratch.
>>Oh, wait. You didn't list any names. Just Boston, California...
>>
>>Oh, yeah. Experience...
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> While I do respect aem's opinions, (everybody is entitled to likes and
> dislikes, and I probably respect it MORE since I grew up with parents
> that made me eat stuff I hated and I still hate most of the same stuff
> to this day!), I'm curious as to how he can tell "fresh" from reheated
> pasta.
I can't imagine. I've never met anyone who could tell, in all those
years of doing it.
Our technique (and pretty much everybody else's) was to partially cook
the pasta, drain and immediately toss with olive oil. We poured it into
big, metal hotel pans to cool and then portioned it (12 ounces by
weight) into cheapo plastic bags to hold, then into the fridge. Each
shape of pasta had its own cook time: spaghetti for 6 minutes, ziti for
8 minutes, egg papardelle for 5 minutes, etc. When it came time to
"rethermalize" (heh) the pasta, it went into boiling water for about 1
1/2 minutes. It reached full boiled temperature, and we could even do
any of the egg or custard sauces that depended on full heat from the
pasta to cook the egg (carbonara being the most well-known). Our pasta
dishes were very popular, both at lunch and dinner. Typical days in my
last restaurant ranged from a low of around 100 portions up to maybe 350
- as high as 500 on busy days. More for banquets - could go up to 750
some days, especially around the holidays.
> I do that here at home (refrigerate extra pasta coated in Olive oil for
> use the next day) and cannot tell any real difference.
> I especially will do that for pasta salads as it really needs to be well
> chilled prior to adding mayonaisse or it "breaks" it.
Try it one time with a light coating of vinaigrette while it's still
warm. It'll disappear into the pasta. Then after it's cooled, add just a
little mayo. The flavor sparkles.
Pastorio
> Just out of real curiosity, not out of any disagreement.
>
> Pastorio has a point about serving logistics in real life, high volume
> situations. I just don't see how preparing each order from scratch could
> _possibly_ be practical.
>
> We were very, very close freinds with a married couple from Italy when I
> was growing up. Leo and Maria Scarcelli ran a place called "Leo's
> Italian Restaurant" in Los Angeles California.
>
> He pre-cooked batches of different types of pastas. There was a hot
> basin of olive oil and sausage juice on the back of the grill too with
> meatballs and whole italian sausages for quick use for both pasta dishes
> and pizzas. Maria's lasagna would be made in batches, separated into
> portions and chilled. There were no microwaves at the time so they were
> warmed in the pizza oven.
>
> He also pre-made pizza crusts and stored them on a rack in the kitchen.
>
> Leo also smoked cigars while he was making pizza crusts so there would
> occasionally be a bit of cigar ash on the flour board. ;-)
>
> This was back in the early 70's.
>
> Cheers!
|
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11mj9k3k3inv7e3@corp.supernews.com>,
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
> > I do that here at home (refrigerate extra pasta coated in Olive oil for
> > use the next day) and cannot tell any real difference.
> > I especially will do that for pasta salads as it really needs to be well
> > chilled prior to adding mayonaisse or it "breaks" it.
>
> Try it one time with a light coating of vinaigrette while it's still
> warm. It'll disappear into the pasta. Then after it's cooled, add just a
> little mayo. The flavor sparkles.
>
> Pastorio
That sounds good! Thanks! :-)
Even a little bottled italian dressing might be interesting.
The holidays are coming up and pasta salads makes good potluck. I like
to use the tri-colored twisty pasta and add sliced olives, mayo (lime
based) and fake crab, along with some minced chives and basil if I have
it on hand.
Cheers!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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