| Sally Swindells |
Can anyone help - I have just attempted to eat a meal of skate wings
which were as 'tough as old boots!'
The fish was very fresh (collected from fisherman this morning as he
sorted his catch). We used a new recipe which involved simmering for
20 minutes in water and a tiny bit of white wine vinegar and a little
chopped onion and carrot. I wonder if it was this longer than usual
cooking time that caused the problem. Usually I fry for 4-5 minutes on
each side, or poach for about 12 minutes.
They were completely inedible, and ended up being whizzed in the food
processor with a portion of mashed potatoes (mine!) and made into fish
cakes, which were actually quite nice.
Do I avoid skate wings in future, or were they just overcooked?
--
Sally at the Seaside~~~~~~~where the fish is fresh from the sea
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <436685E4.9C1404E1@sonic.net>,
Mark Thorson <nospam@sonic.net> wrote:
> Peter Aitken wrote:
> >
> > We had heard that properly prepared the wings
> > taste like scallops. Not to us!
>
> One of my college professors asserted that
> counterfeit scallops were made by punching
> them out of skate wings.
Stingray.
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| Bob (this one) |
Mark Thorson wrote:
> Nancy Young wrote:
>
>>Bob, several people have said they've heard of the practice,
>>and now a site you agree is usually reliable says it, even
>>including the shark, and you still say it doesn't happen?
>
>
> I'll bet he doesn't believe in ESP or UFO's either,
> even though there's tons of people who've experienced
> them (or know people who have)! :-)
Yes.
Pastorio
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| Bob (this one) |
Nancy Young wrote:
> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote
>
>>Nancy Young wrote:
>
>>>I just googled and right away found this:
>>>
>>>http://www.foodsubs.com/Shelfish.html
>>
>>Well, that's generally an accurate site, but not this time.
>
> Bob, several people have said they've heard of the practice, and
> now a site you agree is usually reliable says it, even including the
> shark, and you still say it doesn't happen?
We've all heard of things that didn't happen. The poodle being dried in
a microwave, the hook on the car door handle...
Whoever wrote that about shark being served as scallops has never
handled and cooked shark. There's not the remotest possibility of
confusing the two. Shark eats like fish. I've cooked literally thousands
of pounds of it in my various operations. Not a chance they'd be confused.
> The fact is, substitutions are widely done in the fish world, not just
> with scallops. Perhaps you wouldn't be fooled, but you can bet a lot
> of people would be.
I truly doubt it in the case of scallops. And I say that because I've
handled probably 50 different kinds of fish, shellfish and mollusks over
the years. Cooked, raw (where safe), pickled, preserved...
I have yet to see anything that can be substituted for scallops
convincingly. Or even remotely.
> I think I'd know a sea scallop but I wouldn't
> swear to it, and bay scallops? Forget it, you could easily fool me.
> I just don't eat much in the way of seafood.
Then you're not likely to buy scallops and are no judge of them. But
people who do won't be fooled by shark meat or punched out skate wings.
They don't look the same or even close to scallops.
> There was another big stink (no pun intended) in the news about
> fish a few years back, redfish? ha! it's really (whatever) at redfish
> prices. Etc. Happens all the time.
Substituting one kind of fish for another is something I could do all
day long and no one could tell except someone extremely knowledgeable.
There are four or five textures of fin fish and that's all there is. If
I served a flatfish sauteed in butter and dressed with parsley, I
daresay not one in 10,000 could identify what kind it is. But if I
served shark - any shark - next to a scallop, the difference is like
beef and grapefruit. No relationship to each other. Texture, flavor,
color, mouthfeel, smell, bite - all different from each other.
>>In all my years of restaurant operations, I've never seen "scallops" made
>>from skate wings. But I've heard about it. Maybe my fish guys knew me
>>better than to try. Dunno...
>
> See, even you've heard about it, so it's not something we've snatched
> out of thin air. It is done, it is true.
Because we've heard of it doesn't mean it happens. Having heard of it is
no more an indication of truth than having heard about dragons and
ghosts and faces on Mars.
I haven't said it's not true, I've said that in more than three decades
of active involvement in all phases of professional foodservice, I've
never seen it. In all my operations, I was the purchasing agent and
executive chef and we served an awful lot of water critters. I never saw
it. Not once.
I might begin to believe it if someone whose knowledge I trusted said he
or she had seen it firsthand. Until then... Nope. It's an unproven
assertion. An urban legend until I see something that actually proves it.
Pastorio
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| Bob (this one) |
-L. wrote:
> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>>Whoever wrote that about shark being served as scallops has never
>>handled and cooked shark. There's not the remotest possibility of
>>confusing the two.
>
> If you have never had either, how would you know? A lot of ****ty
> restaurants pass off one thing as another. Most sheeple wouldn't know
> the difference.
> <snip>
You seem to be confining your observations to people who know nothing
about what they're eating. The only problem with that is the restaurants
don't know who's knowledgeable and who isn't. What do they do, ask
customers to fill out a form first so they know who to screw?
>>Then you're not likely to buy scallops and are no judge of them.
>
> Why would she not belikely to buy scallops?
She said she doesn't do much seafood.
> We all tried them once for
> the first time, sometime. And one doesn't have to be a good judge of
> something to be fooled.
> <snip>
Right. And what about the second time? Or are we now limiting this
discourse to first timers only?
>>Substituting one kind of fish for another is something I could do all
>>day long and no one could tell except someone extremely knowledgeable.
>>There are four or five textures of fin fish and that's all there is. If
>>I served a flatfish sauteed in butter and dressed with parsley, I
>>daresay not one in 10,000 could identify what kind it is. But if I
>>served shark - any shark - next to a scallop, the difference is like
>>beef and grapefruit. No relationship to each other. Texture, flavor,
>>color, mouthfeel, smell, bite - all different from each other.
>
> Which matters not one iota if the diner has never had scallops or
> shark.
> <snip>
<LOL> Did you just post for the sake of doing it?
>>I might begin to believe it if someone whose knowledge I trusted said he
>>or she had seen it firsthand. Until then... Nope. It's an unproven
>>assertion. An urban legend until I see something that actually proves it.
>>
> Oh please. You can bet that some jerk somewhere is passing off skate,
> shark - or any other lower-cost seafood item - as scallops. Or cat as
> duck. Or turkey as ostrich. Or whatever.
Right. You feel the need for belligerence and everybody else is stupid.
The specific examples you just offered show how little you know about
these foods. They're each sufficiently different that these
substitutions would *only* fool someone who had never had them before.
Do lots of people who've never had ostrich before seek it out in
restaurants, not knowing anything about it?
Save your fingers for typing messages with content.
Pastorio
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| Shaun aRe |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:11md7ect3dlhm49@corp.supernews.com...
> Actually, it's not at all true. Very different textures for all of them.
> The meat of skate wings looks different than scallop meat and is more
> firm to the touch. And shark is a fish, nothing like scallop.
Uhhmm, they're both fish, and actually in the same family/class -
Chondrichtyes (sp?) (along with ray etc.)
I can't see skate being used as faux scallops either, texture-wise - when
cooked especially, should be a dead give away.
Shaun aRe
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| Nancy Young |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote
> Nancy Young wrote:
>> Bob, several people have said they've heard of the practice, and
>> now a site you agree is usually reliable says it, even including the
>> shark, and you still say it doesn't happen?
>
> We've all heard of things that didn't happen. The poodle being dried in a
> microwave, the hook on the car door handle...
I think it's pretty well documented that restaurants will try to pull
the wool over customer's eyes to save money. No, not all, but
to flat out say it never happens? Don't go getting all excited, but
that is naive. And I know you're not.
> Whoever wrote that about shark being served as scallops has never handled
> and cooked shark. There's not the remotest possibility of confusing the
> two. Shark eats like fish. I've cooked literally thousands of pounds of it
> in my various operations. Not a chance they'd be confused.
See, that's the thing. A) I never said *they* were confused. Chinese
restaurants who serve cat are not *confused* either. B) What matters
is does the customer know the difference?
>> The fact is, substitutions are widely done in the fish world, not just
>> with scallops. Perhaps you wouldn't be fooled, but you can bet a lot
>> of people would be.
>
> I truly doubt it in the case of scallops.
I know you do. That's why this isn't an argument, you really don't
think it happens.
> And I say that because I've handled probably 50 different kinds of fish,
> shellfish and mollusks over the years. Cooked, raw (where safe), pickled,
> preserved...
I know. I'm not disputing that.
> I have yet to see anything that can be substituted for scallops
> convincingly. Or even remotely.
For *you* ... you are in the business and know. I would not
sit here and tell you, 100%, that I would know. Especially, as
you say, if it's an ingredient in a dish with other 'stuff' ... perhaps
people would not notice.
>> There was another big stink (no pun intended) in the news about
>> fish a few years back, redfish? ha! it's really (whatever) at redfish
>> prices. Etc. Happens all the time.
>
> Substituting one kind of fish for another is something I could do all day
> long and no one could tell except someone extremely knowledgeable. There
> are four or five textures of fin fish and that's all there is. If I served
> a flatfish sauteed in butter and dressed with parsley, I daresay not one
> in 10,000 could identify what kind it is. But if I served shark - any
> shark - next to a scallop, the difference is like beef and grapefruit. No
> relationship to each other. Texture, flavor, color, mouthfeel, smell,
> bite - all different from each other.
We're sure as hell not arguing that. That isn't the question. I think
even I could tell if it was put in front of me in a taste test.
>> See, even you've heard about it, so it's not something we've snatched
>> out of thin air. It is done, it is true.
>
> Because we've heard of it doesn't mean it happens. Having heard of it is
> no more an indication of truth than having heard about dragons and ghosts
> and faces on Mars.
Now, if you think that's a face on Mars, I'd think you were stupid.
That's lame. I don't know why, though, it's incomprehensible to you
that unscrupulous whoever wouldn't try to make a buck passing off
fake scallops.
> I haven't said it's not true, I've said that in more than three decades of
> active involvement in all phases of professional foodservice, I've never
> seen it. In all my operations, I was the purchasing agent and executive
> chef and we served an awful lot of water critters. I never saw it. Not
> once.
But that's you. I'm not talking about you. Not everyone is you.
> I might begin to believe it if someone whose knowledge I trusted said he
> or she had seen it firsthand. Until then... Nope. It's an unproven
> assertion. An urban legend until I see something that actually proves it.
That's okay with me, but you should have more of an open mind
about it. Yes, I know, don't believe everything you read, and I don't,
but when the newspaper actually mentions restaurants that were
fined for the practice, I don't think it's an urban legend. And, no, I
wasn't reading a tabloid and the story on the next page was I was
raised by bumblebees and three headed dog saves owner.
I am not as gullible as you might think, though you're free to think so.
nancy
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| Nancy Young |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote
> Nancy Young wrote:
>> Bob, several people have said they've heard of the practice, and
>> now a site you agree is usually reliable says it, even including the
>> shark, and you still say it doesn't happen?
>
> We've all heard of things that didn't happen. The poodle being dried in a
> microwave, the hook on the car door handle...
I think it's pretty well documented that restaurants will try to pull
the wool over customer's eyes to save money. No, not all, but
to flat out say it never happens? Don't go getting all excited, but
that is naive. And I know you're not.
> Whoever wrote that about shark being served as scallops has never handled
> and cooked shark. There's not the remotest possibility of confusing the
> two. Shark eats like fish. I've cooked literally thousands of pounds of it
> in my various operations. Not a chance they'd be confused.
See, that's the thing. A) I never said *they* were confused. Chinese
restaurants who serve cat are not *confused* either. B) What matters
is does the customer know the difference?
>> The fact is, substitutions are widely done in the fish world, not just
>> with scallops. Perhaps you wouldn't be fooled, but you can bet a lot
>> of people would be.
>
> I truly doubt it in the case of scallops.
I know you do. That's why this isn't an argument, you really don't
think it happens.
> And I say that because I've handled probably 50 different kinds of fish,
> shellfish and mollusks over the years. Cooked, raw (where safe), pickled,
> preserved...
I know. I'm not disputing that.
> I have yet to see anything that can be substituted for scallops
> convincingly. Or even remotely.
For *you* ... you are in the business and know. I would not
sit here and tell you, 100%, that I would know. Especially, as
you say, if it's an ingredient in a dish with other 'stuff' ... perhaps
people would not notice.
>> There was another big stink (no pun intended) in the news about
>> fish a few years back, redfish? ha! it's really (whatever) at redfish
>> prices. Etc. Happens all the time.
>
> Substituting one kind of fish for another is something I could do all day
> long and no one could tell except someone extremely knowledgeable. There
> are four or five textures of fin fish and that's all there is. If I served
> a flatfish sauteed in butter and dressed with parsley, I daresay not one
> in 10,000 could identify what kind it is. But if I served shark - any
> shark - next to a scallop, the difference is like beef and grapefruit. No
> relationship to each other. Texture, flavor, color, mouthfeel, smell,
> bite - all different from each other.
We're sure as hell not arguing that. That isn't the question. I think
even I could tell if it was put in front of me in a taste test.
>> See, even you've heard about it, so it's not something we've snatched
>> out of thin air. It is done, it is true.
>
> Because we've heard of it doesn't mean it happens. Having heard of it is
> no more an indication of truth than having heard about dragons and ghosts
> and faces on Mars.
Now, if you think that's a face on Mars, I'd think you were stupid.
That's lame. I don't know why, though, it's incomprehensible to you
that unscrupulous whoever wouldn't try to make a buck passing off
fake scallops.
> I haven't said it's not true, I've said that in more than three decades of
> active involvement in all phases of professional foodservice, I've never
> seen it. In all my operations, I was the purchasing agent and executive
> chef and we served an awful lot of water critters. I never saw it. Not
> once.
But that's you. I'm not talking about you. Not everyone is you.
> I might begin to believe it if someone whose knowledge I trusted said he
> or she had seen it firsthand. Until then... Nope. It's an unproven
> assertion. An urban legend until I see something that actually proves it.
That's okay with me, but you should have more of an open mind
about it. Yes, I know, don't believe everything you read, and I don't,
but when the newspaper actually mentions restaurants that were
fined for the practice, I don't think it's an urban legend. And, no, I
wasn't reading a tabloid and the story on the next page was I was
raised by bumblebees and three headed dog saves owner.
I am not as gullible as you might think, though you're free to think so.
If anything, I am the cynic in this discussion.
nancy
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| Nancy Young |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:11me8bhc8tl4q22@corp.supernews.com...
> Mark Thorson wrote:
>> Nancy Young wrote:
>>
>>>Bob, several people have said they've heard of the practice,
>>>and now a site you agree is usually reliable says it, even
>>>including the shark, and you still say it doesn't happen?
>>
>>
>> I'll bet he doesn't believe in ESP or UFO's either,
>> even though there's tons of people who've experienced
>> them (or know people who have)! :-)
>
> Yes.
Please note that Mark is the one who said:
One of my college professors asserted that
counterfeit scallops were made by punching
them out of skate wings.
This was not followed up by "and I think that's the stupidest
thing I ever heard, what a moron." He just put it out there.
nancy
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <dk7npr$q70$1@news.monmouth.com>,
"Nancy Young" <qwerty@monmouth.com> wrote:
> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote
>
> > Nancy Young wrote:
>
> >> Bob, several people have said they've heard of the practice, and
> >> now a site you agree is usually reliable says it, even including the
> >> shark, and you still say it doesn't happen?
> >
> > We've all heard of things that didn't happen. The poodle being dried in a
> > microwave, the hook on the car door handle...
>
> I think it's pretty well documented that restaurants will try to pull
> the wool over customer's eyes to save money. No, not all, but
> to flat out say it never happens? Don't go getting all excited, but
> that is naive. And I know you're not.
>
> > Whoever wrote that about shark being served as scallops has never handled
> > and cooked shark. There's not the remotest possibility of confusing the
> > two. Shark eats like fish. I've cooked literally thousands of pounds of it
> > in my various operations. Not a chance they'd be confused.
>
> See, that's the thing. A) I never said *they* were confused. Chinese
> restaurants who serve cat are not *confused* either. B) What matters
> is does the customer know the difference?
>
> >> The fact is, substitutions are widely done in the fish world, not just
> >> with scallops. Perhaps you wouldn't be fooled, but you can bet a lot
> >> of people would be.
> >
> > I truly doubt it in the case of scallops.
>
> I know you do. That's why this isn't an argument, you really don't
> think it happens.
>
> > And I say that because I've handled probably 50 different kinds of fish,
> > shellfish and mollusks over the years. Cooked, raw (where safe), pickled,
> > preserved...
>
> I know. I'm not disputing that.
>
> > I have yet to see anything that can be substituted for scallops
> > convincingly. Or even remotely.
>
> For *you* ... you are in the business and know. I would not
> sit here and tell you, 100%, that I would know. Especially, as
> you say, if it's an ingredient in a dish with other 'stuff' ... perhaps
> people would not notice.
>
> >> There was another big stink (no pun intended) in the news about
> >> fish a few years back, redfish? ha! it's really (whatever) at redfish
> >> prices. Etc. Happens all the time.
> >
> > Substituting one kind of fish for another is something I could do all day
> > long and no one could tell except someone extremely knowledgeable. There
> > are four or five textures of fin fish and that's all there is. If I served
> > a flatfish sauteed in butter and dressed with parsley, I daresay not one
> > in 10,000 could identify what kind it is. But if I served shark - any
> > shark - next to a scallop, the difference is like beef and grapefruit. No
> > relationship to each other. Texture, flavor, color, mouthfeel, smell,
> > bite - all different from each other.
>
> We're sure as hell not arguing that. That isn't the question. I think
> even I could tell if it was put in front of me in a taste test.
>
> >> See, even you've heard about it, so it's not something we've snatched
> >> out of thin air. It is done, it is true.
> >
> > Because we've heard of it doesn't mean it happens. Having heard of it is
> > no more an indication of truth than having heard about dragons and ghosts
> > and faces on Mars.
>
> Now, if you think that's a face on Mars, I'd think you were stupid.
> That's lame. I don't know why, though, it's incomprehensible to you
> that unscrupulous whoever wouldn't try to make a buck passing off
> fake scallops.
>
> > I haven't said it's not true, I've said that in more than three decades of
> > active involvement in all phases of professional foodservice, I've never
> > seen it. In all my operations, I was the purchasing agent and executive
> > chef and we served an awful lot of water critters. I never saw it. Not
> > once.
>
> But that's you. I'm not talking about you. Not everyone is you.
>
> > I might begin to believe it if someone whose knowledge I trusted said he
> > or she had seen it firsthand. Until then... Nope. It's an unproven
> > assertion. An urban legend until I see something that actually proves it.
>
> That's okay with me, but you should have more of an open mind
> about it. Yes, I know, don't believe everything you read, and I don't,
> but when the newspaper actually mentions restaurants that were
> fined for the practice, I don't think it's an urban legend. And, no, I
> wasn't reading a tabloid and the story on the next page was I was
> raised by bumblebees and three headed dog saves owner.
>
> I am not as gullible as you might think, though you're free to think so.
>
> nancy
>
>
Score... :-)
Well written and delightfully polite.
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <dk7pih$r5j$1@news.monmouth.com>,
"Nancy Young" <qwerty@monmouth.com> wrote:
> "OmManiPadmeOmelet" <Omelet@brokenegz.com> wrote
>
> > Score... :-)
> > Well written and delightfully polite.
>
> SHUT UP! (laughing) nancy
>
>
;-D
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <1130869529.054337.139190@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,
"aem" <aem_again@yahoo.com> wrote:
> sarah bennett wrote:
> > aem wrote:
> >
> > > Yes, we've even heard, directly from the source, of restaurants that
> > > pre-cook their pasta and coat it with oil while they wait for some
> > > unsuspecting customer to order it. -aem
> > >
> >
> > If resturants didn't employ time-savers, no one would wait around for
> > their meals.
> >
> There's time savers and then there's bad cooking. If a restaurant
> preps a dish that takes long cooking and then finishes it when it's
> ordered, fine. If you pre-cook something that needs to be freshly made
> you're cheating the customer. -aem
>
True, but IMHO there is nothing wrong with cooking pasta in advance. :-)
We've cooked too much on occasion and refrigerated it overnight after
coating it with a little olive oil, then re-heating it the next day and
adding the sauce.
It was just fine!
Pasta takes WAY too long to prepare fresh for serving to guests at a
restaurant!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <1130870915.229734.169750@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
"aem" <aem_again@yahoo.com> wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> >
> > True, but IMHO there is nothing wrong with cooking pasta in advance. :-)
> > We've cooked too much on occasion and refrigerated it overnight after
> > coating it with a little olive oil, then re-heating it the next day and
> > adding the sauce.
> >
> > It was just fine!
>
> We'll just have to agree to disagree about this. We think reheated
> pasta sucks.
I'm ok with that.
Everybody's tastes differ.
Probably depends a lot on how "al-dente'" it is (or however that is
spelled <G>)
> >
> > Pasta takes WAY too long to prepare fresh for serving to guests at a
> > restaurant!
> >
> Simply not true, unless you patronize those places which bring your
> entire order five minutes after you place it. Good food is worth
> waiting a little longer for. That's why you're munching on bread and
> antipasto. -aem
Or the wonderful salad and bread sticks at Olive Garden..... ;-d
>
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| Bob Myers |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:11mdb3nq6kghk2c@corp.supernews.com...
> > Oh, there was a big brouhaha in the papers here some
> > years ago, places selling skate as scallops.
>
> It would have to be a pretty dumb buyer not to spot the difference.
Gee, Bob, you say that as though the world was in danger
of running out of dumb buyers....
Bob M.
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| aem |
Bob (this one) wrote:
>
> *Badly* reheated, improperly cooked pasta sucks. Done properly, it's
> indistinguishable from freshly cooked.
>
Indistinguishable to you, maybe.
> Small problem. You own a restaurant with 100 seats. The tables fill as
> they do, unevenly and unpredictably over the dinner hours. [snip]
> Pasta takes too long to cook from scratch for each order. Even if you're
> using fresh pasta that cuts the cook time way down. You have to use new
> water for each batch or the texture of the later batches gets sticky and
> gummy. It all takes time and burners and hands.
I think maybe you had not 30 years' experience but 1 year's experience
30 times. Or 30 years at not very good restaurants. -aem
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| Damsel |
Nancy Young wrote:
>
> (laugh) The funny thing is, no trouble at all, google on skate scallops and
> article after article pops right up. But, the reason I did post that (and I
> will stop) is that I feel that I came within a whisker of being called a
> liar, something I am very touchy about. Hot button time for me.
As well it should be.
Bob and Nancy, try taking a step back and looking at this dispute from
an overall perspective. It just ain't important in the whole scheme of
things. No one has to be right.
It makes me sad to see my good friend Nancy's intentions being
questioned. She's one of the more honest and true people you'll ever
meet.
Carol
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11mg5h78uvgt0de@corp.supernews.com>,
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
> Bob Myers wrote:
> > "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote
> >
> >>Actually, darlin, no. My restaurants all featured exotic meats and water
> >>critters - lion, hippo, llama, snakes, barracuda, rays, urchins...
> >
> > OK, so I have to admit that the above resulted in a pretty strange
> > mental image... a whole roast hippo being wheeled out to some
> > customer's table, with, of course, a watermelon in its mouth.....
> >
> > (Seriously, though, how DID you offer hippo?)
>
> I bought big chunks of the round from Czimer foods out of Lockport, IL.
> (And later, I bought other wild meats from World Safari in Wash D.C.) It
> was boneless, so I roasted it at low temperature, saved the (fairly
> scant) drippings and made a sauce with them. I chilled the roast and ran
> it through my slicer. I put weighed-out portions into plastic bags with
> a measured amount of sauce and chilled them. When they were ordered, I
> put the bag into hot (190°F) water to reheat and slid the meat and sauce
> onto a bed of rice for service.
>
> I did all the meats that way except snake. We sauteed sections of the
> snakes with meat still on ribs and served it with a nopales cactus pad
> and a sauce based on snake pan juices and the (snotty) liquid from the
> cactus. I hated it. Customers liked it. Go figure.
>
> Pastorio
IMHO snake is best de-boned and served like boneless chicken.
When we lived above the Mojave Desert, the neighbor boys used to like to
hunt rattlesnakes. They would bring them to me to skin because, one, I
did not mind doing and two, I could get the skin off with the rattles
still attached. There is a very simple trick to doing that. ;-)
So, the snakes they brought me would be so fresh, the hearts would still
be beating most of the time. I'd skin them, clean them and put them into
a ziplock bag in the freezer.
At the end of one summer, we had about 40 timber rattlers in the
freezer! Mom pressure cooked them and deboned them, (most of the meat is
along the spine) then canned it in 1/2 pint jars.
She used it mostly in salads or in rice dishes. It had a texture similar
to chicken but had a slightly fishy flavor. It was quite good.
I'll pass on the nopales. You are right, they are slimy. There is a
spineless edible prickly pear that grows around here and I'm still
experimenting with the young pads trying to find a good way to prepare
them.
Cheers!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| Bob (this one) |
Mark Thorson wrote:
> "Bob (this one)" wrote:
>
>>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>>
>>>I don't see how anyone can eat cat.
>>
>>So it, um, tastes like chicken and could pass in a nice sauce, right...?
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> Breaded, deep-fried, and called "mountain scallops". :-)
<LOL> To go with the "mountain oysters." Maybe call it the "Mixed, er,
Seafoodish Plate"
Lots of beer. Much beer...
Pastorio
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| Bob (this one) |
Sheldon wrote:
> Damsel wrote:
>
>>Sheldon wrote:
>>
>>>Damsel wrote:
>>>
>>>>Nancy Young wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>(laugh) The funny thing is, no trouble at all, google on skate scallops and
>>>>>article after article pops right up. But, the reason I did post that (and I
>>>>>will stop) is that I feel that I came within a whisker of being called a
>>>>>liar, something I am very touchy about. Hot button time for me.
>>>>
>>>>As well it should be.
>>>>
>>>>Bob and Nancy, try taking a step back and looking at this dispute from
>>>>an overall perspective. It just ain't important in the whole scheme of
>>>>things. No one has to be right.
>>>
>>>So you're saying Nancy is wrong,
Can you not read, moron? The assertion isn't about actually being right,
it's about the dispute and how it needn't be absolute. But why would you
even begin to understand that, antisocial fool that you are.
>>> her posts are to be discounted, she lied... which?
Illiterate buffoon.
>>>I don't think so. I don't think so. I don't think so.
>>>
>>>Sheldon
>>
>>You talkin' to me, or to Roberto?
>
> You. C'mon sweetie, you can't pull a cop-out fence walk and get away
> scot free. If no one is right then you're saying both are wrong... and
> what about me who sided with Nancy... it ain't just the two and you
> playing god ya know... if no one has to be right then you're saying I'm
> chopped liver.
Yes. You're chopped liver. Any questions? You're too stupid and too
obsessed with me to ever get it right. You're pushing a fight where
there isn't one so you can see someone get a shot in at me. Fraud.
>>I'm behind Nancy 100%.
More like you're Nancy's behind.
> Ah, well, you can only have 100% to dole out so according to you there
> is no partial credit... I guess it appears poor old ferschtunkinah
> Roberto is royally ****ed... because in your position above what at
> first blush what you *seem* to be saying is that you're behind Nancy
> 100%, and you are, but you don't say *how* you're behind Nancy 100%.
> Obviously by simple logic by not taking any side but at the same time
> invoking being behind Nancy 100% (not behind poor widdle schtinko
> Roberto at all) you're saying that you're behind Nancy being 100%
> *wrong*... discounted, and a liar to boot.
Give it up, logic-boy. You don't get it. You have never gotten it. You
never will get it.
> Sorry, no fence walking, not on Usenet.
<LOL> Oh, look, Shecky is setting rules for Usenet. Mr. No-rules himself.
> There was obviously a dispute
> occuring, dispute couldn't be more obvious.
Poor dimbulb Cookie Katz can't see the difference between discourse and
dispute. And, of course, in his crank world, it must proceed to one
winner and one loser. Idiot.
> When one really hasn't the
> cojones to take a position it's best to stay mute, ie. butt out. You
> can't be everybody's friend all the time... that's how you always hurt
> someone. You seem to want to walk into a room and by the power vested
> (by WTFGod I haven't a clue) want the disputing parties to instantly
> become all kissy-face.
And here's the poster boy for social incompetence having the point
whooosh right by his feeble brain. For him, impotent old fool that he
is, it's either 100% together or 100% combative. That's why he keeps
getting smacked around by strong and weak alike. No such thing as
disagreeing with friends, right Shecky? Anybody disagrees is an enemy.
Idiot.
> Life is not so idealistic like that, that's why
> you fall into so much emotional discord. There's a word for what your
> being trying to walk the fence... it's what in the end Nero discovered
> of Brutus... et tu.
<LOL> Is there anything funnier than a halfwit trying not to sound like
it and then sounding like it? It was Caesar who discovered anything
about Brutus, Sheckele. But I note Shecky didn't put that "word" down.
Whatever it is...
> M-W
>
> fick·le
> adjective
> Etymology: Middle English fikel deceitful, inconstant, from Old English
> ficol deceitful; akin to Old English befician to deceive, and probably
> to Old English fAh hostile -- more at _FOE_
>
> : marked by lack of steadfastness, constancy, or stability
> : given to erratic changeableness
>
> synonym see INCONSTANT
> ---
>
> Actually *I'm* behind Nancy 100%, and there is absolutely no mistaking
> which way, none whatsoever (just see my previous post).
The one with the URL's that turned out badly for you? That one?
> I like that in
> a person, a lot, that you know fer absolute certain where they stand
> and and will remain standing where they say for all eternity... it's
> the only good thing I can say about ferschluganuh Roberto, don't have
> to agree with him, and mostly I don't, but you always know where he
> stands, he's a pompous ass and most times hasn't a clue what he's
> ranting about but he thinks he knows... he ain't fickle. Did I just
> say that... I must be on drugs.
I suspect you are on drugs. Like a emotional diuretic and a mental laxative.
> Sometimes you just gotta agree to disagree... and keep to your own
> side, but at least it's a side. In reality I actually share better'n
> five miles of stone wall, I love those ancient walls and walk along
> them often, occasionally meeting a neighbor doing the same... at very
> best each emits a low unintelligible grunt, each signifing only on
> which side each stands. No one ever walks on the wall. Life is good.
And what poor Mr Katz utterly misses from his poem quoted below is that
Frost laments the existence of the walls. The narrator says, "If I could
put a notion in his head:" not because he thinks walls are good. But
because they seem to be necessary. And I note yet another example of the
Right Honorable Buttwad S. Martin Katz has once again violated a
copyright in quoting a whole work still in copyright. But what else
would we expect?
Pastorio
>
> MENDING WALL
> Robert Frost
>
> Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
> That sends the frozen-ground-swell under it,
> And spills the upper boulders in the sun,
> And makes gaps even two can pass abreast.
> The work of hunters is another thing:
> I have come after them and made repair
> Where they have left not one stone on a stone,
> But they would have the rabbit out of hiding,
> To please the yelping dogs. The gaps I mean,
> No one has seen them made or heard them made,
> But at spring mending-time we find them there.
> I let my neighbor know beyond the hill;
> And on a day we meet to walk the line
> And set the wall between us once again.
> We keep the wall between us as we go.
> To each the boulders that have fallen to each.
> And some are loaves and some so nearly balls
> We have to use a spell to make them balance:
> 'Stay where you are until our backs are turned!'
> We wear our fingers rough with handling them.
> Oh, just another kind of out-door game,
> One on a side. It comes to little more:
> There where it is we do not need the wall:
> He is all pine and I am apple orchard.
> My apple trees will never get across
> And eat the cones under his pines, I tell him.
> He only says, 'Good fences make good neighbors'.
> Spring is the mischief in me, and I wonder
> If I could put a notion in his head:
> 'Why do they make good neighbors? Isn't it
> Where there are cows?
> But here there are no cows.
> Before I built a wall I'd ask to know
> What I was walling in or walling out,
> And to whom I was like to give offence.
> Something there is that doesn't love a wall,
> That wants it down.' I could say 'Elves' to him,
> But it's not elves exactly, and I'd rather
> He said it for himself. I see him there
> Bringing a stone grasped firmly by the top
> In each hand, like an old-stone savage armed.
> He moves in darkness as it seems to me~
> Not of woods only and the shade of trees.
> He will not go behind his father's saying,
> And he likes having thought of it so well
> He says again, "Good fences make good neighbors."
>
>
> Sheldon (definitely has em, big'uns... never any guessing)
>
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| Nancy Young |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote
> Nancy Young wrote:
>> I did sum up what I'd read, and it wasn't in the vein of an
>> urban legend.
>
> C,mon, Nancy. You said you'd read it years before, somewhere you weren't
> sure of. I know my memory plays tricks on me, is yours without flaw?
That's good for a laugh, my memory was never that great to
begin with and it ain't getting any better. But, just as I thought
oh, fake scallops/skate punch, interesting, I also remember oh,
that crappy seafood cafeteria place over on Ocean Blvd where
I ate exactly once maybe in the late 70s. That's how my memory
works. Oh, that place. Interesting.
(laugh) I sure didn't mentally file it away thinking it might be
of use some day. Brain sludge.
> > To me, when you say prove it, essentially, you're
>> saying I made it up. That's how I took it.
>> You are closed to that possibility, I'm open to it,
>
> Nancy, this is a rather straightforward misstatement. I'm absolutely not
> closed to the possibility and have said so in the specific.
When I said, it's true, it happens, what were your first words
to me in this thread?
Actually, it's not at all true.
That's where I'm coming from.
> Why are you "open to it" with little evidence to support its likelihood?
Because I'm a cynic. It rings true to me that 'some' people would
try to get away it. I also think they could get away with it, too.
> I'm sorry if I've offended you. It's never been my intention.
No, if I was at all offended, it was because I'm touchy about
someone questioning my honesty, and that for damn sure is
not your fault.
> I'm sorry to have distressed you.
No worries.
nancy
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| Bob Myers |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:11mg5h78uvgt0de@corp.supernews.com...
> I bought big chunks of the round from Czimer foods out of Lockport, IL.
> (And later, I bought other wild meats from World Safari in Wash D.C.) It
> was boneless, so I roasted it at low temperature, saved the (fairly
> scant) drippings and made a sauce with them. I chilled the roast and ran
> it through my slicer. I put weighed-out portions into plastic bags with
> a measured amount of sauce and chilled them. When they were ordered, I
> put the bag into hot (190°F) water to reheat and slid the meat and sauce
> onto a bed of rice for service.
And so, in the immortal words of Eric Idle: "...What's it like?"
I'm tempted to call up the meat department at the local
HyperMegaUltraMart and see if they'd get me some hippo, but
I have an idea what the outcome might be. On the other hand,
it may still be a good idea, just for the entertainment value. Hell,
I could call up with a whole list of meats I'd like 'em to order for
me, starting with "hippo" and then working my way through to
"long pig"...;-)
Bob M.
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <2f8im1d7ifuuilo215epfbmkikg05o4i6n@4ax.com>,
Sally Swindells <sally_swindells@hotREMOVEMEmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 19:13:19 +0000 (UTC), Sally Swindells
> <sally_swindells@hotREMOVEMEmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Can anyone help - I have just attempted to eat a meal of skate wings
> >which were as 'tough as old boots!'
> >
> >The fish was very fresh (collected from fisherman this morning as he
> >sorted his catch). We used a new recipe which involved simmering for
> >20 minutes in water and a tiny bit of white wine vinegar and a little
> >chopped onion and carrot. I wonder if it was this longer than usual
> >cooking time that caused the problem. Usually I fry for 4-5 minutes on
> >each side, or poach for about 12 minutes.
> >
> >They were completely inedible, and ended up being whizzed in the food
> >processor with a portion of mashed potatoes (mine!) and made into fish
> >cakes, which were actually quite nice.
> >
> >Do I avoid skate wings in future, or were they just overcooked?
>
> Two days later -
>
> I thought it was such a simple question, but 120 posts later plus a
> couple of homicides (?) I realise it wasn't.
>
> I had no idea I was opening a can of snakes and Hippopotamus all
> served with Pasta!
> --
> Sally at the Seaside~~~~~~~
>
ROFL!!!
On this list, one never knows where thread drift is going to wander!
Well done anyway, and I hope you got your question answered? :-)
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <1130968860.276498.116920@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
"Sheldon" <PENMART01@aol.com> wrote:
> This is an example of the type of pasta cooker what restaurants use, a
> large guido restaurant would have a whole bank of them:
> http://store.bowerykitchens.com/pastacooker.html
Damn! I want one of those for steaming veggies. :-)
I use my pasta cooker (with the strainer insert) for steaming veggies
all the time, but different ones need different steaming times, for
instance carrots versus brocolli, so I just add them to the pot at
different times.
This way, I could start them all at once and just remove each one when
done.
Thanks Shel'!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| Bob (this one) |
aem wrote:
> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>>aem wrote:
>>
>>>So you assert five more times that restaurants don't cook pasta to
>>>order, and you argue at great length that in your experience it can't
>>>be done, it takes too long, it taxes kitchen resources too greatly.
>>>
>>>That's your experience and what you know.
>>
>>Sorry, aem, it's what *the industry* knows. [snip the rest]
>
> Nothing new here. Same old denial of the validity of anyone else's
> experience but your own. Guess we're done. -aem
Um, you've offered no "experience" information except to say that you
can tell when pasta is reheated and you only patronize those places that
cook from scratch.
How can you tell? What would be the informing characteristics?
How do you know? Relate your experience. Try to do a bit better than you
did when listing "names" of places that you're sure cook from scratch.
Oh, wait. You didn't list any names. Just Boston, California...
Oh, yeah. Experience...
Pastorio
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| Bob (this one) |
Sheldon wrote:
> aem wrote:
>
>>Bob (this stronzo pinocchio) dishonest mother****er fabricates:
Oh, look. It's Shecky "OCD R US" Katz. His Tourettes is just running
away with him. Again. Still...
Let us remember a few things about what follows:
1) Sheldon is a former Navy shipboard cook. It's where he got his
"gourmet" training.
2) Sheldon has never operated a restaurant. Of any kind. Ever.
3) Sheldon has never worked in a restaurant of any kind. Ever.
4) He makes all these wonderful pronouncements that more show his
debility than much valuable information.
5) Most of his "good" information comes from plagiarizing cookbooks and
poor Sharon Tyler Herbst.
6) He seems consumed with me, probably because I've nailed his feeble
ass so many times.
Now let us examine this latest missive...
> I'm sure there are pasta bending joints that prepare pasta in advance
> but not many (never ate at Olive Garden so perhaps there) but I've
> never witnessed even one, and I've eaten pasta in just about all 48,
> and extensively in NYC, Chicago, up and down CA, and East Beantown,
> even some Joisey joints, none served reheated pasta (actually makes no
> sense, flys in the face of basic Physics 101).
What makes no sense is this convoluted (and diseased, but that's another
subject) sentence. So what if he eats in every restaurant on earth. He
still has no idea what happens in the kitchen.
His comment about physics is on a par with his brilliant assertion that
Nero learned something from Brutus. Same intellectual level. Same
educational level. Unfortunately.
> No sit down restaurant wants you should begin chowing down ten
> minutes after you arrive anyway... in fact not only don't they want to
> rush by reheating pasta (which actually as you will soon see wastes
> time and ruins pasta), they wait at least ten minutes before putting up
> the patron's pasta, maybe longer if they ordered a salad/appetizer, in
> hopes they'll order another round.
This is where our resident rectal polyp shows his true brilliance.
Restaurants *want* you to eat and get out so they can put another party
at that table.
[...]
> This is an example of the type of pasta cooker what restaurants use, a
> large guido restaurant would have a whole bank of them:
> http://store.bowerykitchens.com/pastacooker.html
"Measures 14" diam., 7" depth."
You moron, it's almost exclusively used for reheating it. Or did you not
notice that it's 7-inches deep (and very few are any deeper than that).
Commercial spaghetti (and fettuccine, and capellini and linguine and
mafalde and all other strand pasta) is at least 10-inches long It sticks
out the top of the pot several inches because you can't fill the pot to
the brim when it's boiling, and, BTW, the spaghetti slides out through
the holes on the bottom of the insert. Here's how raw spaghetti looks in
one: <http://www.restaurantequipment.com/vollrath_pasta.html>
These pots are typically set at a boil during mealtimes, as we did. They
go through a lot of water in evaporation, and can't be filled very full
because the starch from the pastas boils up. We had to keep ours about
3-inches down from the top because of that and we had to top-up often.
We also had to empty and refill every 30 minutes or so because the water
got starchy and it made the pastas sticky.
Putting one of these pots on a stove takes one burner... And a lot of
further space around it for the handles of the inserts. You can't fill a
stove with several of these pots. They interfere with each other and
with the hands trying to work with them.
High-volume pasta operations use a whole different process that poor,
out-of-touch Sheckele doesn't even know about. Here's a page with info
about one kind of pasta cooker.
<http://www.selectappliance.com/exec...duct/fm_gsms-sc>
Note the reference to portions. Note the baskets to reheat.
More of the same: <http://www.fryerworld.com/index-pastacookers.html>
A smaller commercial unit.
<http://www.selectappliance.com/exec...uct/nm_6750-240>
"Optional basket set #66787 comes with 6 - 4" x 4" x 4" individual
serving baskets." Does anyone believe that pasta can be *cooked* in a 4
X 4 X 4 basket?
Pasta is a whole restaurant world that most people never see.
<http://www.pastasupplyworld.com/>
And many restaurants have sauces in individual portion pouches. They
"rethermalize (love jargon) - reheat - them in units like these:
<http://www.fryerworld.com/frymaster-fbr18.html>
As usual, Shecky.
Like it or not, approve of it or not, it's done and done in most
operations. Cooking pastas to order in the average restaurant isn't
easily done, four-section pot or not. Takes too many hands, too much
stove space, and too much fussing.
Pastorio
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| Bob (this one) |
Sheldon wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
>>I noted it did not have a lid and that's important for steaming so yes,
>>I'll do more searching.
>>
>>I still appreciate it as I did not know such an item even exsisted.
>
>
> Here's another type of commercial pasta cooker, kicked up quite a few
> notches... the typical home cook wouldn't know about this one either
> but anyone claiming to have extensive restaurant experience would, most
> definitely.
>
> http://www.selectappliance.com/exec...ers,+Restaurant
<LOL> Exactly. And only a quarter hour after I already posted it. Good
job, Shecky. Keep on Googlin'
Sloppy and second.
Story of your life.
Pastorio
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11mivsv9ctnc6fe@corp.supernews.com>,
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
> These pots are typically set at a boil during mealtimes, as we did. They
> go through a lot of water in evaporation, and can't be filled very full
> because the starch from the pastas boils up. We had to keep ours about
> 3-inches down from the top because of that and we had to top-up often.
> We also had to empty and refill every 30 minutes or so because the water
> got starchy and it made the pastas sticky.
Pastorio,
why could you not portion the pasta into bags, then re-heat them in
"boiling bags" or was it necessary for hot water to come in contact with
the noodles?
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| Bob (this one) |
OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> In article <11mivsv9ctnc6fe@corp.supernews.com>,
> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>These pots are typically set at a boil during mealtimes, as we did. They
>>go through a lot of water in evaporation, and can't be filled very full
>>because the starch from the pastas boils up. We had to keep ours about
>>3-inches down from the top because of that and we had to top-up often.
>>We also had to empty and refill every 30 minutes or so because the water
>>got starchy and it made the pastas sticky.
>
> why could you not portion the pasta into bags, then re-heat them in
> "boiling bags" or was it necessary for hot water to come in contact with
> the noodles?
Faster to just drop it into the water directly and more sure of heating
everything evenly. Besides, "retortable pouches" (industry term) mean
extra handling, extra equipment to seal them, and extra costs for materials.
Pastorio
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| Shaun aRe |
"Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:11mfo0nnrrgt94c@corp.supernews.com...
> Shaun aRe wrote:
>
> > I have never once seen nor heard of shark meat being sold in UK chip
> > shops or even pre-packaged 'DIY' fish and ships.
>
> "The spiny dogfish, one half of a British staple take-away food, fish
> and chips, under its other names of dogfish or rock salmon..."
> <http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/2661419.stm>
Never seen it on a chip shop menu myself, and a search only turns up that it
is sometimes offered, along with skate and hake, in some southern fish and
chip outlets (as a slightly exotic alternative, at higher prices). It is
*offered as* what *it is*, too - I only said I'd never had shark that could
be mistaken/passed off as chip-shop white fish.
> I had "flake" fish and chips in Oz, which is also shark meat.
>
> Pastorio
>
> > We almost invariably get very white, very flaky types of fish and
> > I've not once eaten shark that could be made to pass for it. Also,
> > shark meat tends to cost more here than most typical chip shop white
> > fish such as cod and haddock - it's seen as a bit of an exotic by
> > most, although it is much more readily available now than say 10
> > years ago!.
Cheers Bob,
Shaun aRe
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| Shaun aRe |
"Sally Swindells" <sally_swindells@hotREMOVEMEmail.com> wrote in message
news:2f8im1d7ifuuilo215epfbmkikg05o4i6n@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 19:13:19 +0000 (UTC), Sally Swindells
> <sally_swindells@hotREMOVEMEmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Can anyone help - I have just attempted to eat a meal of skate wings
> >which were as 'tough as old boots!'
> >
> >The fish was very fresh (collected from fisherman this morning as he
> >sorted his catch). We used a new recipe which involved simmering for
> >20 minutes in water and a tiny bit of white wine vinegar and a little
> >chopped onion and carrot. I wonder if it was this longer than usual
> >cooking time that caused the problem. Usually I fry for 4-5 minutes on
> >each side, or poach for about 12 minutes.
> >
> >They were completely inedible, and ended up being whizzed in the food
> >processor with a portion of mashed potatoes (mine!) and made into fish
> >cakes, which were actually quite nice.
> >
> >Do I avoid skate wings in future, or were they just overcooked?
>
> Two days later -
>
> I thought it was such a simple question, but 120 posts later plus a
> couple of homicides (?) I realise it wasn't.
>
> I had no idea I was opening a can of snakes and Hippopotamus all
> served with Pasta!
LOL!
It *is* simple Sally, as were the direct answers - what's complicated, is
how some threads just go utterly nutso, heheheh...
Just cook the buggers in some butter (pepper and garlic optional LOL!), few
minutes a side, just until the flesh is no longer translucent at all, then
whip 'em out the pan and serve. I'm certain they will be delicious unless
the fish was naff stuff to start with.
Shaun aRe
|
|
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| ~patches~ |
OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> In article <1130988341.765294.148900@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> "Sheldon" <PENMART01@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
>>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>>
>>>I noted it did not have a lid and that's important for steaming so yes,
>>>I'll do more searching.
>>>
>>>I still appreciate it as I did not know such an item even exsisted.
>>
>>Here's another type of commercial pasta cooker, kicked up quite a few
>>notches... the typical home cook wouldn't know about this one either
>>but anyone claiming to have extensive restaurant experience would, most
>>definitely.
>>
>>http://www.selectappliance.com/exec...ookers,+Restaur
>>ant
>>
>>Sheldon
>>
>
>
> Oh yah, like I can afford that... <lol>
>
> Just out of curiosity, how many folks (following this thread anyway) use
> a pasta pot for steaming? It works VERY well and since one's kitchen can
> easily become cluttered with too many cute gadgets, it's nice to have a
> dual purpose pot!
I hear you on the clutter issue. I have a few things that do double or
triple duty. My pasta pot has a deep insert with a lot of larger holes
and a smaller steamer basket. The pasta insert is perfect for steaming
larger amounts of vegetables and is used for this purpose more than
cooking pasta. Steaming is one of my preferred methods of cooking
veggies. My rice cooker came with a steamer basket too so I can cook
rice & steam veggies at the same time.
|
|
|
| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11mk19kgc0pndd1@corp.supernews.com>,
~patches~ <noones_home@thisaddress.com> wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
> > In article <1130988341.765294.148900@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> > "Sheldon" <PENMART01@aol.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> >>
> >>>I noted it did not have a lid and that's important for steaming so yes,
> >>>I'll do more searching.
> >>>
> >>>I still appreciate it as I did not know such an item even exsisted.
> >>
> >>Here's another type of commercial pasta cooker, kicked up quite a few
> >>notches... the typical home cook wouldn't know about this one either
> >>but anyone claiming to have extensive restaurant experience would, most
> >>definitely.
> >>
> >>http://www.selectappliance.com/exec...+Cookers,+Resta
> >>ur
> >>ant
> >>
> >>Sheldon
> >>
> >
> >
> > Oh yah, like I can afford that... <lol>
> >
> > Just out of curiosity, how many folks (following this thread anyway) use
> > a pasta pot for steaming? It works VERY well and since one's kitchen can
> > easily become cluttered with too many cute gadgets, it's nice to have a
> > dual purpose pot!
>
> I hear you on the clutter issue. I have a few things that do double or
> triple duty. My pasta pot has a deep insert with a lot of larger holes
> and a smaller steamer basket. The pasta insert is perfect for steaming
> larger amounts of vegetables and is used for this purpose more than
> cooking pasta. Steaming is one of my preferred methods of cooking
> veggies. My rice cooker came with a steamer basket too so I can cook
> rice & steam veggies at the same time.
I've even heard of steaming meat in a rice cooker. :-)
Steaming fish or chicken is a good way to cook it.
My pasta pot originally came with a higher set steamer insert, but I've
mis-placed it! If I want to use more water for longer steaming periods
(or for when I steam eggs and want minimal water contact when the water
boils up) I'll stick a screen strainer into the insert inside of the
pasta pot insert.
It is amazing isn't it how many tools and devices one can end up with
for cooking? Mom used to gripe when we moved (back when we rented before
I bought a house) that it _always_ took the longest time to pack the
kitchen! ;-D
Cheers!
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
|
|
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <11mk4u2o675um8d@corp.supernews.com>,
~patches~ <noones_home@thisaddress.com> wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
> > In article <11mk19kgc0pndd1@corp.supernews.com>,
> > ~patches~ <noones_home@thisaddress.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>In article <1130988341.765294.148900@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
> >>> "Sheldon" <PENMART01@aol.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>I noted it did not have a lid and that's important for steaming so yes,
> >>>>>I'll do more searching.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>I still appreciate it as I did not know such an item even exsisted.
> >>>>
> >>>>Here's another type of commercial pasta cooker, kicked up quite a few
> >>>>notches... the typical home cook wouldn't know about this one either
> >>>>but anyone claiming to have extensive restaurant experience would, most
> >>>>definitely.
> >>>>
> >>>>http://www.selectappliance.com/exec...ta+Cookers,+Res
> >>>>ta
> >>>>ur
> >>>>ant
> >>>>
> >>>>Sheldon
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Oh yah, like I can afford that... <lol>
> >>>
> >>>Just out of curiosity, how many folks (following this thread anyway) use
> >>>a pasta pot for steaming? It works VERY well and since one's kitchen can
> >>>easily become cluttered with too many cute gadgets, it's nice to have a
> >>>dual purpose pot!
> >>
> >>I hear you on the clutter issue. I have a few things that do double or
> >>triple duty. My pasta pot has a deep insert with a lot of larger holes
> >>and a smaller steamer basket. The pasta insert is perfect for steaming
> >>larger amounts of vegetables and is used for this purpose more than
> >>cooking pasta. Steaming is one of my preferred methods of cooking
> >>veggies. My rice cooker came with a steamer basket too so I can cook
> >>rice & steam veggies at the same time.
> >
> >
> > I've even heard of steaming meat in a rice cooker. :-)
> > Steaming fish or chicken is a good way to cook it.
> >
> > My pasta pot originally came with a higher set steamer insert, but I've
> > mis-placed it! If I want to use more water for longer steaming periods
> > (or for when I steam eggs and want minimal water contact when the water
> > boils up) I'll stick a screen strainer into the insert inside of the
> > pasta pot insert.
> >
> > It is amazing isn't it how many tools and devices one can end up with
> > for cooking? Mom used to gripe when we moved (back when we rented before
> > I bought a house) that it _always_ took the longest time to pack the
> > kitchen! ;-D
> >
> >
> >
> > Cheers!
>
> Isn't it though. I have a couple of items on my Christmas list and I
> really *must have* a juicer. The problem is finding spots to store
> everything. My kitchen has more than sufficient cabinets but they are
> stuffed full. I don't have enough counter space to leave a whole lot
> out either. When the stove isn't in use the burners double as spots to
> set baskets of fruits & veggies. My kitchen canning rack is over
> flowing and even the chest freezer top is used to set things on. This
> house used to be a summer cottage then it went through 4 additions -
> bedrooms upstairs, small room to the side, small entry at the other
> side, and finally front porch enclosed then combined with two existing
> rooms to make a great room. I have almost no storage :( But I *have*
> to have the cooking gadgets!
Partial solution for me has been to install some of those lovely "snap
together" rubbermade cabinets. Lowe's sells them! they are easy to put
together, move around and to keep clean. And you can put more stuff on
top of them. <lol> I also use my oven for storage of extra pots and
pans.
IMHO you will get more use out of a Victorio strainer (with the motor
attachment) than a juicer! Really! And it can be used for juicing.
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
|
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| Bob (this one) |
Sheldon wrote:
> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
>>In article <11mj77gdhechaa0@corp.supernews.com>,
>> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>>
>>>OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>>>
>>>>In article <11mivsv9ctnc6fe@corp.supernews.com>,
>>>> "Bob (this one)" <Bob@nospam.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>These pots are typically set at a boil during mealtimes, as we did. They
>>>>>go through a lot of water in evaporation, and can't be filled very full
>>>>>because the starch from the pastas boils up. We had to keep ours about
>>>>>3-inches down from the top because of that and we had to top-up often.
>>>>>We also had to empty and refill every 30 minutes or so because the water
>>>>>got starchy and it made the pastas sticky.
>>>>
>>>>why could you not portion the pasta into bags, then re-heat them in
>>>>"boiling bags" or was it necessary for hot water to come in contact with
>>>>the noodles?
>>>
>>>Faster to just drop it into the water directly and more sure of heating
>>>everything evenly. Besides, "retortable pouches" (industry term) mean
>>>extra handling, extra equipment to seal them, and extra costs for materials.
>>>
>>>Pastorio
>>
>>Makes sense. ;-)
>>And Pasta is cheap.......
>
> With all his fancy schmancy restaurants all they have is one fercocktah
> stove and one friggin' pot... sheesh, what a BSer. LOL
<LOL> Indeed, ****wit. Where did you find "one fercocktah stove and one
friggin' pot" in what I wrote. If you weren't such an obsessed moron,
you'd read what was on the screen and try to understand it. Did the
numbers of portions I indicated we served not tip you off to how we had
to handle things? Oh, wait. You've never worked in a restaurant, so you
have no idea... Sorry.
My last restaurant had four stoves, usually designated as two for the
kitchen line and two for banquets, but subject to change as needs
developed. Went with the four convection ovens. The 6-foot flattop, the
four two-bay fryers and a whole lot of other equipment you've never
heard of because you, um, have no restaurant experience.
> Putzo didn't know any more about those pots than you until I posted it,
> and then the worm spends hours searching commercial websites and posts
> links to things he never
<LOL> Hours... I spent hours searching, you say. But checking posting
times, it sure is less time than you, buttjelly. I spent about ten
minutes and found about a dozen examples to explain the range of
available equipment to the folks here. I posted a few of them. You
showed up with one of the things I had posted just soon enough after I
did to try to claim credit - for your own demento reasons. Nice try,
blowhole.
Bzzzzzzzzzt.
I just don't understand why you feel the need to pretend to knowledge
you clearly don't have. Why you pretend to experience you clearly don't
have. But mostly I don't understand your insane, Nazi-like prejudices
and rants. You sound like a junior Hitler. An even more unbalanced
Goebbels. It is a singular astonishment seeing a Jew posting the things
you do. I guess no group has a monopoly on vulgarity and no group is
immune. But it's especially and sadly ironic to see a person from one of
the most persecuted people in history using the same rhetoric that has
been used against them. You're a sick, sick man...
> even dreamed about... friggin filthy pinocchio.
<LOL> So Sheldon. Where have you ever handled any of this stuff? Or even
stood in the same room with any of it? I mean since you haven't worked
in commercial foodservice. Ever. And not in anything but a home kitchen
since the early 60's when you were a mess cook on a ship; the true home
of gourmet cooking. <snerk>
Your crazy rants are so stupidly transparent that you heap further
discredit on yourself each time you post your diseased brain-vomit.
Pastorio
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| tinbartolome@skyinet.net |
Peter Huebner wrote:
> In article <Omelet-A6EBA7.17575131102005@corp.supernews.com>,
> Omelet@brokenegz.com says...
> >
> > I have been told that cut Stingray is supposed to taste similar, but
> > I've never had the chance to try Stingray.
> >
>
> I have. A friend kept catching them so one day I went over there and did
> my skate receipe. Waste of time. Stingray is a lot like stringy
> tasteless cardboard. You could possibly grind it, douse it with
> artificial flavours and sell it for crapsticks, but otherwise a flop.
> Unfortunate, since they are big and numerous here. We have lots of 6'
> stingrays in the harbour.
>
> -P.
>
> --
> =========================================
> firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com
I am from an Asian Third World Country where "exotic food" is a daily
staple. Sting ray is daily fare in my husband's hometown. It's first
cleaned well then cooked in tons of calamansi, (small citrus fruits
native to our country that taste a little bit like lemon), slices of
ginger, minced garlic and onions seasoned with some salt and pepper.
When tender, the ray is drained, flaked and then cooked in coconut
cream and small red chilis and chili leaves or malunggay (local version
of horseraddish) leaves are added.
While we don't usually eat snake and alligators, other unusual seafood
are eels (even the local moray eel), crustaceans (including tiny crabs
and shrimp) as well as molluscs-- all are also cooked in coconut cream.
In other parts of the country, insects are roasted or cooked in a
little oil!
=)
|
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| OmManiPadmeOmelet |
In article <1131784400.612623.261190@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
tinbartolome@skyinet.net wrote:
> Peter Huebner wrote:
> > In article <Omelet-A6EBA7.17575131102005@corp.supernews.com>,
> > Omelet@brokenegz.com says...
> > >
> > > I have been told that cut Stingray is supposed to taste similar, but
> > > I've never had the chance to try Stingray.
> > >
> >
> > I have. A friend kept catching them so one day I went over there and did
> > my skate receipe. Waste of time. Stingray is a lot like stringy
> > tasteless cardboard. You could possibly grind it, douse it with
> > artificial flavours and sell it for crapsticks, but otherwise a flop.
> > Unfortunate, since they are big and numerous here. We have lots of 6'
> > stingrays in the harbour.
> >
> > -P.
> >
> > --
> > =========================================
> > firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com
>
>
> I am from an Asian Third World Country where "exotic food" is a daily
> staple. Sting ray is daily fare in my husband's hometown. It's first
> cleaned well then cooked in tons of calamansi, (small citrus fruits
> native to our country that taste a little bit like lemon), slices of
> ginger, minced garlic and onions seasoned with some salt and pepper.
> When tender, the ray is drained, flaked and then cooked in coconut
> cream and small red chilis and chili leaves or malunggay (local version
> of horseraddish) leaves are added.
>
> While we don't usually eat snake and alligators, other unusual seafood
> are eels (even the local moray eel), crustaceans (including tiny crabs
> and shrimp) as well as molluscs-- all are also cooked in coconut cream.
> In other parts of the country, insects are roasted or cooked in a
> little oil!
>
> =)
>
The other stuff sounds good, (and thanks for that skate recipe!) but
I'll pass on the bugs, thanks. ;-)
Thia food seems to cook with a lot of coconut cream. It's available
canned for a very good price at our Asian market in Austin.
Fresh "green" coconuts too.
--
Om.
"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson
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| EastneyEnder |
Newsgroups: rec.food.cooking
X-Trace: newsfe1-win.ntli.net 1131803277 82.2.2.153 (Sat, 12 Nov 2005 13:47:57 GMT)
User-Agent: Microsoft-Outlook-Express-Macintosh-Edition/5.02.2022
Mime-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 13:47:57 GMT
Xref: spool6-east.superfeed.net rec.food.cooking:1124864
tinbartolome@skyinet.net wrote:
> I am from an Asian Third World Country where "exotic food" is a daily
> staple. Sting ray is daily fare in my husband's hometown. It's first
> cleaned well then cooked in tons of calamansi, (small citrus fruits
> native to our country that taste a little bit like lemon), slices of
> ginger, minced garlic and onions seasoned with some salt and pepper.
> When tender, the ray is drained, flaked and then cooked in coconut
> cream and small red chilis and chili leaves or malunggay (local version
> of horseraddish) leaves are added.
>
> While we don't usually eat snake and alligators, other unusual seafood
> are eels (even the local moray eel), crustaceans (including tiny crabs
> and shrimp) as well as molluscs-- all are also cooked in coconut cream.
> In other parts of the country, insects are roasted or cooked in a
> little oil!
Ooh! Being very nosy, but are you from Burma? I've flown over it several
times and always wanted to go there (but not with the current politics).
Sue
Portsmouth, UK
--
pen-drake location ntl-world-.-com minus hyphens.
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| Sheldon |
Nancy Young wrote:
> "Mark Thorson" > wrote in message
> > Peter Aitken wrote:
> >>
> >> We had heard that properly prepared the wings
> >> taste like scallops. Not to us!
> >
> > One of my college professors asserted that
> > counterfeit scallops were made by punching
> > them out of skate wings.
>
> It's true. I have also heard that they might be made of
> shark. I think it was Stan who said check out the scallops,
> if they are all identical size, that's a tipoff.
But of course, seafood is substituted all the time, all types of
seafood, a very common practice by both fish mongers and restaurants
(often restaurants don't know exactly what they are buying, not any
more than the average consumer does.
We're not talking here about two guys in essentially a rowboat going
out for the day to test their luck... we're talking huge fleets/armadas
of professional fishing boats and huge factory ships at sea for months
at a time sweeping the seas of *everything*.
Restaurants make up menus for say dover sole or red snapper, just so
they sound flamboyant... do you really think they are serving dover
sole or red snapper, only by accident... that can be any kind of sole
or not sole at all, can be any kind of flat fish, flounder, fluke, even
halibut.... and can be any of a dozen different snapper and there're
are myriad fish that can be substituted for snapper.
And one wont find specific info regarding particular incidents
pertaining to substituting seafood as there's nothing to be done about
it... there is nothing illegal about the practice... leastways not in
the US... fish rarely if ever gets inspected ('cept canned), and
certainly isn't USDA graded. Folks buy canned tuna all the time, it's
actually albacore or is it bonito, maybe, who really knows what exactly
is in that can... the packers cover their butts by prominently
displaying *Albacore*... there's no law says it has to be 100%, in fact
there is no law says any seafood marketed has to be 100%. And then
there are sardines, you've all seen the vast array of itty bitty tins
labeled "Sardines", well, whaddaya know, there is no such fish as a
"sardine".
Like all seafood most is seasonal and some seasons are rather short.
It's rare today to find fresh scallop at fish mongers, certainly not
all year. Most is sold frozen, even the finest restaurants use frozen
scallop, and once frozen it's not really possible to determine whether
it's scallop, or skate, or shark, or monkfish. And there are many
kinds of scallop, same as there are many kinds of skate... and once
cooked no one can tell, and again, it may be dishonest/immoral but it
is NOT illegal to substitute seafood, and restaurants especially
substitute *everything*, all the time, and most times restaurants don't
know because their suppliers often don't know either.
skate
This odd-looking, kite-shaped fish is also called a ray . The names are
used interchangeably, though in some quarters the term "skate" is
applied to the members of this species that are used for eating, while
"ray" generally refers to those (like the electric ray and giant manta
ray) that are fished for sport. Skates have winglike pectoral fins that
undulate as the fish meanders along the ocean floor (there are also
freshwater rays). The fins are the edible part of a skate. Their
delicious flesh is firm, white and sweet - not unlike that of the
SCALLOP. Depending on the region, skate is available year-round. Like
SHARK meat, skate must be soaked in ACIDULATED WATER to remove its
natural ammonia odor. Skate can be prepared in a variety of ways
including poaching, baking and frying.
=A9 Copyright Barron's Educational Services, Inc. 1995 based on THE FOOD
LOVER'S COMPANION, 2nd edition, by Sharon Tyler Herbst.
---
http://www.foodsubs.com/Shelfish.html#scallop
bay scallops =3D Chinese scallops Shopping hints: These are easier to
find in the East than in the West. Frozen scallops are a good
substitute for fresh. Substitutes: calico scallop (not as sweet) OR
sea scallop (This is larger than the bay scallop, and less sweet and
delicate. Consider cutting it into bite-size pieces before cooking.) OR
shark meat (Note: Unscrupulous restaurants sometimes palm off shark
meat as scallops to unsuspecting customers.) OR cod cheeks OR skate
See also: scallops
sea scallop Substitutes: bay or calico scallop (these are smaller
than sea scallops, and more sweet and delicate) OR shark meat (Note:
Unscrupulous restaurants sometimes palm off shark meat as scallops to
unsuspecting customers.) OR cod cheeks OR skate OR monkfish
---
Sheldon
|
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| Bob (this one) |
Sheldon wrote:
> It's rare today to find fresh scallop at fish mongers, certainly not
> all year. Most is sold frozen, even the finest restaurants use
> frozen scallop, and once frozen it's not really possible to determine
> whether it's scallop, or skate, or shark, or monkfish. And there are
> many kinds of scallop, same as there are many kinds of skate...
Scallops are all adductor muscles and, as such, have muscle fibers
running top to bottom. When cooked, fiber ends are visible, but the
scallop remains solid. Skate wings have muscles running side to side
and, when cooked, flake like fish. No one has produced even one
documented example of this actually happening from anyone even remotely
expert in the field. It's another one of those "everybody knows it"
things that just ain't so - like searing meat to seal in the juices...
And references from knowledgeable industry people say it's just a rumor.
An urban legend.
If you were to see these products just once, you'd know that this
substitution business is pure crap.
> and once cooked no one can tell,
*YOU* can't tell. Anyone who has ever eaten a scallop would spot the
fake instantly.
> and again, it may be dishonest/immoral but it is NOT illegal to
> substitute seafood,
Could you be more moronic? Do you think fraud-in-business laws somehow
don't apply to foodservice? What do you think the truth-in-menu laws are
about? It is absolutely illegal to provide something other than that
which is being offered for sale on menus.
> and restaurants especially substitute *everything*, all the time,
Sheldon, you are dead wrong. Period. As usual, you make it into some
extreme situation "*everything*, all the time" so that your very
extremism makes what you say unbelievable. Sure there are some
substitutions on occasion. But "*everything*, all the time" is
ridiculous on the face of it.
> and
> most times restaurants don't know because their suppliers often don't
> know either.
Poor deficient Sheldon thinks that everyone is like him. People spend
years, decades in a field and they don't learn anything. Right.
And isn't it funny that this discussion is like a week old and Sheldon
chimes in with the same old unfounded nonsense.
Anyone who can't tell the difference between skate and scallop, shark
and scallop or monkfish and scallop has never eaten any of them. They
don't look alike, smell alike, taste like each other, or have even
remotely similar mouthfeel.
Pastorio
|
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| Sheldon |
Sally Swindells wrote:
> On Mon, 31 Oct 2005 14:52:32 -0600, OmManiPadmeOmelet
> <Omelet@brokenegz.com> wrote:
>
> >In article <nlqcm1t2b8mkdvrj7vdh7c1t8hqnjali3q@4ax.com>,
> > Sally Swindells <sally_swindells@hotREMOVEMEmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Can anyone help - I have just attempted to eat a meal of skate wings
> >> which were as 'tough as old boots!'
> >>
> >> The fish was very fresh (collected from fisherman this morning as he
> >> sorted his catch). We used a new recipe which involved simmering for
> >> 20 minutes in water and a tiny bit of white wine vinegar and a little
> >> chopped onion and carrot. I wonder if it was this longer than usual
> >> cooking time that caused the problem. Usually I fry for 4-5 minutes on
> >> each side, or poach for about 12 minutes.
> >>
> >> They were completely inedible, and ended up being whizzed in the food
> >> processor with a portion of mashed potatoes (mine!) and made into fish
> >> cakes, which were actually quite nice.
> >>
> >> Do I avoid skate wings in future, or were they just overcooked?
> >> --
> >> Sally at the Seaside~~~~~~~where the fish is fresh from the sea
> >>
> >
> >Did you peel them?
>
> Thanks everyone for your help.
>
> They were approx 10" x 7" each, and were cooked on the bone unskinned.
Then it wasn't skate wings, they have no bones... and their skin is
inedible, it's as tough as shark hide. Skate has a layer of cartilage
running throughout the entire wing closer to the upper surface. Had
you purchased it from a fish monger the skin would have been removed
and the flesh stripped from the cartilage. If you cooked it with skin
and cartilage intact it would have curled fairly tightly and cooked
more than five minutes would become tough as an old tire carcass. I
seriously doubt what you had is skate. Perhaps you had mammoth
scallop! <G>
Ahahahahahaha. . . .
Sheldon
Sheldon
|
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